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post #11 of 20 (permalink) Old 08-18-2018, 09:27 PM
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Still laughing.

The extent and extremism you're insinuating isn't even close.

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post #12 of 20 (permalink) Old 08-18-2018, 09:47 PM
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Hehehe.... ok... my work in this general area since the 1980s, including several years as the CEO of a major regional ISP is just pure bullshit....
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post #13 of 20 (permalink) Old 08-18-2018, 10:10 PM Thread Starter
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I wouldn't discount it. If you've ever watched Minority Report... it's not all fiction. Businesses and government make it a priority to try and track every last millimeter of movement from you to 'know' you better.

Back on subject, I tried a dozen different carriers and, curiously enough, they are all coming back with the same figure plus or minus a few dollars every 6mos. I don't know if it has more to do with the fact I'm single, the fact I don't own a home or the fact I live in California (or likely a little of all three), but it's disgusting that I might actually have to pay $200/mo for car insurance with no violations and only one minor accident.
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post #14 of 20 (permalink) Old 08-18-2018, 10:25 PM
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I wouldn't discount it. If you've ever watched Minority Report... it's not all fiction. Businesses and government make it a priority to try and track every last millimeter of movement from you to 'know' you better.

Back on subject, I tried a dozen different carriers and, curiously enough, they are all coming back with the same figure plus or minus a few dollars every 6mos. I don't know if it has more to do with the fact I'm single, the fact I don't own a home or the fact I live in California (or likely a little of all three), but it's disgusting that I might actually have to pay $200/mo for car insurance with no violations and only one minor accident.

Same here, I was pissed at Geico's rate hike, went ahead to get new quotes from other carriers and they all came back with same general numbers, I have no accidents, no traffic violations and credit is immaculate on my record.


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post #15 of 20 (permalink) Old 08-18-2018, 11:10 PM
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Same here, I was pissed at Geico's rate hike, went ahead to get new quotes from other carriers and they all came back with same general numbers, I have no accidents, no traffic violations and credit is immaculate on my record.
Have you guys tried Liberty Mutual?

I switched to them from Allstate last year. The difference was close to 30% that was after switching from Progressive to Allstate the year before that saved me 20%.

As a side note it was mentioned that they all know every time you buy a beer.... but yet that person shops carriers every 6 months. Guess they don't all have the same info. There are many out there, keep shopping. Sometimes it's worth getting an Insurance House that carry's several different company's to shop for you as well.

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post #16 of 20 (permalink) Old 08-19-2018, 07:38 PM
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We have USAA and our auto insurance is extremely cheap. Try them?

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post #17 of 20 (permalink) Old 08-19-2018, 10:09 PM Thread Starter
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We have USAA and our auto insurance is extremely cheap. Try them?
USAA is only for military and their immediate family. My sister served USN for 6yrs but when she recommended I try them, I wasn't qualified. I think Mercury might be my next route. They broke the mold of everyone else and charged me what I figured would be fair after my incident. We'll see if the quote holds. I have another 3wks left to check further.
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post #18 of 20 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 09:22 AM
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USAA is only for military and their immediate family. My sister served USN for 6yrs but when she recommended I try them, I wasn't qualified. I think Mercury might be my next route. They broke the mold of everyone else and charged me what I figured would be fair after my incident. We'll see if the quote holds. I have another 3wks left to check further.
Bummer! Good luck. Insurance is lame but it's nice for the other person to have when they hit you

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post #19 of 20 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 01:57 PM
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Have you guys tried Liberty Mutual?

I switched to them from Allstate last year. The difference was close to 30% that was after switching from Progressive to Allstate the year before that saved me 20%.

As a side note it was mentioned that they all know every time you buy a beer.... but yet that person shops carriers every 6 months. Guess they don't all have the same info. There are many out there, keep shopping. Sometimes it's worth getting an Insurance House that carry's several different company's to shop for you as well.
They all analyze it differently because each of the models is built in-house and yes, some do not buy as much data, or keep it as current as often, as others. Data is not free and neither is analysis; in addition all of the firms reduce their data analysis into a "score" which is basically a coefficient (multiplier) for the base "best" rate.

Further, essentially all insurance firms will "poach" (that is, intentionally price "first policy" with them, assuming you already have insurance at an attractive price) because they know customers are "sticky." They run THAT as part of their pricing model too; exactly how much can they raise your price on renewal and you WON'T give them the finger and shop the policy. Of course for some people the answer is "$1" but for nearly everyone it's not, and yes, they model that too, know exactly where the line is on a statistical basis and they walk right up to it.

Geico, incidentally, is famous for doing this as is Progressive.

One cute "enhancement" in their data models is that they used to be able to (as a result of state law reporting requirements and DMV data links) know you had current insurance before issuing you a quote. Now they all know exactly what limits you currently have as well -- despite your current insurance being with a different company which "allegedly" has a "privacy policy".....
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Last edited by tickerguy; 08-20-2018 at 02:00 PM.
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post #20 of 20 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 03:50 PM
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Every bit of it is true. I was employed in a key role at a company that was trying to do this before it was commercially viable to store and process all of this sort of data -- they went under. I've worked since on various projects that did not fail and both the CPU and storage requirements to do this sort of correlation analysis are a tiny fraction of the cost they were in the '90s.

The chip-card thing was a convenient (and necessary, sadly, due to the ease of ripping off a magstripe) foil to essentially force POS integration and thus Level 3 data collection upon virtually everyone in the retail space, although a fair number of mag-stripe reader systems were Level 3 integrated before the conversion started.

The reason the merchants go along with it is that they get a materially lower discount rate in exchange for doing so.

Any place that has the card terminal connected to the POS (and all "contactless" payment systems) must be assumed to be sending Level 3 data and the card network, the issuing bank and their affiliates all own that information. There are darn few stand-along "XON" style terminals still out there that provide only a total amount of the ticket with a time stamp and MCC (merchant category code) today.

If you think it's limited to there you're dead wrong as well. LexisNexis is thought of as a legal database research firm -- hahahaha, that's nowhere near all what they do any more than Nielsen just does TV ratings..... Then there's the fact that in a bankruptcy of a firm you did business with their data set is a marketable asset, will be sold, and whoever buys it can do whatever they want with it, with very, very few constraints.
Hey google, what do you NOT know?
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