Unofficial 2017 Mazda6 Rumor Thread - Page 52 - Mazda 6 Forums : Mazda 6 Forum / Mazda Atenza Forum
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post #511 of 596 (permalink) Old 08-08-2016, 09:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TitaniumVT View Post
I posted a recent interview with Mazda's CEO a week ago:
http://forum.mazda6club.com/future-models/380321-unofficial-2017-mazda6-rumor-thread-49.html#post4714898
Probably no more credible source than the head of the company:

"...The next-generation Skyactiv technologies, dubbed Skyactiv 2, will encompass an overhaul of the entire platform, far more than just the engines, Matsumoto said. He pledged to introduce the second phase by March 2019.

Skyactiv 2 will pick up where the first generation left off, focusing on lightweighting, better ride and handling, and improved fuel economy, he said. A new gasoline engine now under development will be 30 percent more efficient than the current Skyactiv powerplants, the company said.

Mazda engineers expect to reach the new levels by cranking up the engine’s compression ratio to 18:1 from the current 14:1. Higher engine compression tends to improve fuel economy by allowing a leaner mix of fuel to combust..."

March 2019 is a long way out. If this is right, it looks like we may have two more model years of the current body style left to go (2017 and 2018). And if they introduce SkyActiv 2 on the Mazda 3 first, you'll be waiting even longer for the new engine to make its way into the 6.
I saw that. I'm probably just being optimistic, but their published mid term plans give a range of 2017-2019 for first introduction. It all comes down to what it takes to productionize the R&D concepts, which isn't an easy task.

Given it is one chart without a lot of context, but one can read into it that GEN 2 SKYACTIVE components will be incorporated on an as ready basis...I know, wishful thinking. I should just hurry up and buy.

http://www.mazda.com/en/investors/policy/mid-term/

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Last edited by Aroohoo; 08-08-2016 at 10:41 PM.
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post #512 of 596 (permalink) Old 08-08-2016, 10:07 PM
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I'm kind of hoping for a 2018 debut on the SkyActiv G2 system. That gives it a year to work out kinks before I'm likely ready for my next car in 2019. By then, I'll likely have 90K on my odometer.
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post #513 of 596 (permalink) Old 08-08-2016, 10:23 PM
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Mule of the next gen CX-5 have leaked. I wonder if this is based off the new platform that the Mazda6 will use.

SPIED On The STREET! Next-Gen Mazda CX-5 Caught In SoCal For The FIRST Time - AutoSpies Auto News

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post #514 of 596 (permalink) Old 08-09-2016, 08:34 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TitaniumVT View Post
I posted a recent interview with Mazda's CEO a week ago:

"...The next-generation Skyactiv technologies, dubbed Skyactiv 2, will encompass an overhaul of the entire platform, far more than just the engines, Matsumoto said. He pledged to introduce the second phase by March 2019.


March 2019 is a long way out. If this is right, it looks like we may have two more model years of the current body style left to go (2017 and 2018). And if they introduce SkyActiv 2 on the Mazda 3 first, you'll be waiting even longer for the new engine to make its way into the 6.
What's conflicting about that article is that just a few days prior AN posted quotes from that same "roundtable" interview, but with different info from Masahiro Moro who's CEO of MNAO.

http://www.autonews.com/article/2016...ntain-mpg-lead

Quote:
Moro said the second generation of Skyactiv, which should be unveiled in 2017, will be the main driver toward meeting 2021 standards. Skyactiv 2 will use homogenous-charge compression ignition combustion engines, a technology that mimics the compression in diesel engines, which should further improve efficiency in gasoline engines.

But HCCI engines are a “very difficult and delicate technology,” Moro said, so Mazda is working to ensure the engines are durable.
Maybe a difference from the public release in 2017 vs. the entire phase of Skyactiv 2 hitting the entire line up by 2019?

Last edited by aneville11; 08-09-2016 at 08:40 AM.
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post #515 of 596 (permalink) Old 08-09-2016, 09:13 AM
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Originally Posted by michael95350 View Post
Seems like Toyota and Honda have reclaimed the glory of having the best sellers. Recent YTD figures were posted and the 3rd to 10th best vehicles were mostly swept between those 2 manufacturers (Nissan snuck one in):

10) Toyota Corolla
9) Toyota RAV4
8) Honda Accord
7) Honda Civic
6) Nissan Rogue
5) Toyota Camry
4) Honda CR-V

Naturally, the Big 3 pickups took the top 3 spots as they have done for years now. Some things never change... sigh

With that in mind, the Accord and Camry have lost ground for the year (Accord down 7.4% vs 2015 and Camry down 11.2% vs 2015) so at least it seems to be midsize in general taking a hit.
Compact sedans are growing in size and becoming more refined. The Civic has a roomier back seat and is going to be sharing a platform with the next Accord. The upcoming Imprezza will debut a platform to be used with future Subaru models like the Legacy. This puts pressure on Mazda as its aging offerings are aligned in that the 3 was already among the poorest compacts in terms of back seat space and the strength of the 6 was that it offered a midsize sedan with weight more akin to a compact. Now the Civic delivers compact weight but more like midsize interior space and it appears the Subaru is headed there.

For me, the tight backseat is a negative regarding the otherwise excellent 3 and the draw of the 6 is diminished in that refinement and space with the chassis dynamics of a compact is now easier to come by.

In any case, sales of compacts like the Civic and Imprezza, are likely going to improve at the expense of midsizers. Not sure what that means for Mazda but the competition is making a lot of changes.
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post #516 of 596 (permalink) Old 08-09-2016, 11:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Carmissimo View Post
Compact sedans are growing in size and becoming more refined. The Civic has a roomier back seat and is going to be sharing a platform with the next Accord. The upcoming Imprezza will debut a platform to be used with future Subaru models like the Legacy. This puts pressure on Mazda as its aging offerings are aligned in that the 3 was already among the poorest compacts in terms of back seat space and the strength of the 6 was that it offered a midsize sedan with weight more akin to a compact. Now the Civic delivers compact weight but more like midsize interior space and it appears the Subaru is headed there.

For me, the tight backseat is a negative regarding the otherwise excellent 3 and the draw of the 6 is diminished in that refinement and space with the chassis dynamics of a compact is now easier to come by.

In any case, sales of compacts like the Civic and Imprezza, are likely going to improve at the expense of midsizers. Not sure what that means for Mazda but the competition is making a lot of changes.
When you look at what Mazda has been ahead on vs. what they are behind on, it's an interesting dichotomy. Their engine tech and direction has definitely been ahead in some ways, but they also have been behind on turbo 4's. They've underestimated what consumers want as far as power in their quest to deliver top of the line gas mileage. We'll see if their turbo 4 move in the CX-9 will pay off, which would then mean they are ahead again. They've mostly been ahead on refinement in the upper trim levels, but then still lack things like Apple CarPlay and Android Auto.
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post #517 of 596 (permalink) Old 08-09-2016, 11:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carmissimo View Post
Compact sedans are growing in size and becoming more refined. The Civic has a roomier back seat and is going to be sharing a platform with the next Accord. The upcoming Imprezza will debut a platform to be used with future Subaru models like the Legacy. This puts pressure on Mazda as its aging offerings are aligned in that the 3 was already among the poorest compacts in terms of back seat space and the strength of the 6 was that it offered a midsize sedan with weight more akin to a compact. Now the Civic delivers compact weight but more like midsize interior space and it appears the Subaru is headed there.

For me, the tight backseat is a negative regarding the otherwise excellent 3 and the draw of the 6 is diminished in that refinement and space with the chassis dynamics of a compact is now easier to come by.

In any case, sales of compacts like the Civic and Imprezza, are likely going to improve at the expense of midsizers. Not sure what that means for Mazda but the competition is making a lot of changes.
In many ways the Civic sedan now competes with the Mazda6. The interior space is now a closer match and the Civic turbo matches up close to the 2.5L for power. The Civic has the advantage of lower weight, lower cost and better fuel economy. The current 6 is a tough sell to the average buyer today. It really needs the next gen for MY2018.
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post #518 of 596 (permalink) Old 08-09-2016, 11:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aneville11 View Post
What's conflicting about that article is that just a few days prior AN posted quotes from that same "roundtable" interview, but with different info from Masahiro Moro who's CEO of MNAO.

http://www.autonews.com/article/2016...ntain-mpg-lead

Maybe a difference from the public release in 2017 vs. the entire phase of Skyactiv 2 hitting the entire line up by 2019?

Great observation. If you look at the table outlining Mazda's midterm plans at the link that @Aroohoo posted earlier...


http://www.mazda.com/en/investors/policy/mid-term/


...Mazda plans to develop and introduce Gen 2 in the 2017 to 2019 timeframe, but full blown production across the product range isn't planned until 2020+. Just like SkyActiv 1 was a range of technologies under an umbrella brand, I expect the same to be true of SkyActiv 2. We'll probably start seeing announcements about various SkyActiv 2 tech beginning in late 2017 or 2018, followed by limited and staggered introductions on various models beginning in 2018 or 2019+, with the full SkyActiv 2 suite becoming mainstream across all the models by 2020.


Just my speculation, with nothing concrete to back it up other than connecting the dots on what we're reading.


As an aside, it's super impressive to me that Mazda is the only non-electric manufacturer to meet the 2016 Café standards. Major props to their engineering team!
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post #519 of 596 (permalink) Old 08-09-2016, 12:40 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aroohoo View Post

Given it is one chart without a lot of context, but one can read into it that GEN 2 SKYACTIVE components will be incorporated on an as ready basis...I know, wishful thinking. I should just hurry up and buy.

MAZDA: Structural Reform Plan | Management Policy

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I don't know how I overlooked this. Great info on the Target Chart



If you want to be in a good position to trade at the release of Gen4 then you should definitely lease and lease NOW. In my 3 years with Mazda, there has never been a better opportunity. The lease incentives are ridiculous especially on the 6. OVER $2,700 in lease cash alone before factoring any loyalty or step up incentives. Though I'm not sure of the specifics in your region but I do know they're similar across the country. I qualified for over $4,000 off on my most recent lease in May.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TitaniumVT View Post
Great observation. If you look at the table outlining Mazda's midterm plans at the link that @Aroohoo posted earlier...


http://www.mazda.com/en/investors/policy/mid-term/


...Mazda plans to develop and introduce Gen 2 in the 2017 to 2019 timeframe, but full blown production across the product range isn't planned until 2020+. Just like SkyActiv 1 was a range of technologies under an umbrella brand, I expect the same to be true of SkyActiv 2. We'll probably start seeing announcements about various SkyActiv 2 tech beginning in late 2017 or 2018, followed by limited and staggered introductions on various models beginning in 2018 or 2019+, with the full SkyActiv 2 suite becoming mainstream across all the models by 2020.


Just my speculation, with nothing concrete to back it up other than connecting the dots on what we're reading.


As an aside, it's super impressive to me that Mazda is the only non-electric manufacturer to meet the 2016 Café standards. Major props to their engineering team!
Thanks for pointing that out.

Speculation is what this thread is for, right? Those are all very realistic ideas.

I dug around a bit more on that site where I found the outline for Kogai's speech to investors last week regarding 2017 FY outlook. In which, he stated the release of updated 6 and CX5. He also mentions the introduction of 6 new models during this projected outlook. Which leads me to believe that the 6 will be updated for 2018 MY in 2017

Quote:
Global sales in FY March 2017 are projected to increase 16,000 units from the prior year to 1.55million units. We aim for continuous volume growth with the introduction of new models such as the CX-9 and updated models like Mazda6/Atenza and CX-5, which have proved very popular. Sales volume growth is smaller than the prior fiscal year, mainly because expansion of crossover production capacity cannot keep up with pace of increasing demand. Utilization rates will not
increase due to preparations for new model launches scheduled in this fiscal year.
We will enhance production flexibility between passenger vehicles and crossover vehicles, and expand production and sales by around 100,000 units in next two fiscal years to achieve 1.65 million units.
Quote:
First is product and R&D.

During Structural Reform Stage 2, we will launch 6 new models that offer driving pleasure and outstanding environmental & safety performance.
We will continue to advance our SKYACTIV products. The CX-5 and Mazda6, launched in 2012 and updated in 2015, continue to grow in sales globally with reduced incentives. We will introduce the latest design, technology and equipment to all updated models, to improve both volume and profit. We will introduce the updated Mazda3, Mazda6 and CX-3 in this fiscal year.
http://www.mazda.com/globalassets/en...ch_160427e.pdf

What's interesting to me is that he addresses concerns of lower volume to be the fault of production capacities as opposed to public demand. Which to me, is a good problem to have showing that there is still plenty of interest in each model and the entirety of the brand with most attention being the compact crossover segment.
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Last edited by aneville11; 08-09-2016 at 12:57 PM.
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post #520 of 596 (permalink) Old 08-09-2016, 02:12 PM
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Dang, Aneville, you'd make a great detective. Nice find. Kogai's outlook for FY17 and Structural Reform Stage 2 does suggest that the SkyActiv 2 models will be launching before March 2019. He says that the 3, 6 and CX5 will be updated this fiscal year (i.e., before March 2017), which we know is already happening. And that six new models and SkyActiv 2 models will be launching by March 2019. The nuances I can't entirely figure out from his outlook are:

1. Whether the six new models are all going to be SkyActiv 2 based cars

2. Whether the full line will be converted to SkyActiv 2 by March 2019 (the table posted earlier would suggest it won't be until 2020+)

3. Whether it automatically follows that the next gen 6 has to be released for model year 2018.


It seems like this year's updates could carry the 3, 6 and CX-5 for more than 12 months, buying Mazda a bit more time to work the kinks out of the SkyActiv 2 engines. Even if SkyActiv 2 is nearly ready to go, it seems to me they'd launch the next gen 3 first (since it's the volume leader), then either the CX-5 (which sells in higher volume than the 6) or the 6 (which is the halo flagship). Launching all three models on SkyActiv 2 could take us into 2018, which still leaves enough buffer to meet Kogai's stated deadline of March 2019.


If you agree with my logic, it seems like the next gen 6 could be introduced for either the 2018 or 2019 model years.

Last edited by TitaniumVT; 08-09-2016 at 03:05 PM.
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