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No synthetic oil for 2018 2.5T??

28K views 39 replies 12 participants last post by  Mz6GreyGhost 
#1 ·
I stopped by my dealer on Friday to pick up some touch up paint. While I was there, they did the Android Auto update and gave me a complementary oil change. I told them that I wanted them to use synthetic oil. The person in the Service Department who was helping me told me that the manufacturer stated that you should not use synthetic motor oil in the 2.5 Skyactive Turbo. I thought this was strange. She said she would follow up with the technicians as to why. I didn't have time to stick around for an answer, but she said she would call me this week with a thorough explanation.



Has anyone else heard or read this before? I have always used synthetic in my vehicles, so this sounded strange. Studies have shown that synthetic motor oil improves longevity.
 
#2 ·
Nonsense. All of Mazda's skyactiv engines, turbo or NA require synthetic oil.

However, just because an oil claims to be synthetic does not mean it is a good oil, just like an oil that claims to be Dino (non-synthetic) is not necessarily a bad oil.

If you want to do your own oil changes, my recommendation is to use Motul 5W30 it's a very good high performance oil perfect for turbo engines. Another great choice is Liqui-Moly. If you drive in a hot climate, don't hesitate to use 5W40.
 
#5 ·
I stopped by my dealer on Friday to pick up some touch up paint. While I was there, they did the Android Auto update and gave me a complementary oil change. I told them that I wanted them to use synthetic oil. The person in the Service Department who was helping me told me that the manufacturer stated that you should not use synthetic motor oil in the 2.5 Skyactive Turbo. I thought this was strange. She said she would follow up with the technicians as to why. I didn't have time to stick around for an answer, but she said she would call me this week with a thorough explanation.

Has anyone else heard or read this before? I have always used synthetic in my vehicles, so this sounded strange. Studies have shown that synthetic motor oil improves longevity.
Yeah, that's not true. Any engine that takes dino oil can take full synth (maybe except those old rotary engines) with no problems whatsoever. I don't think dino would hurt the SkyActive but Mazda recommends full synth so it's not worth saving a couple bucks twice a year going against their specs. Weird they would tell you that.
 
#6 ·
I don't have much confidence in the girl who was helping me. I mentioned that I like to change my own oil, and had purchased a filter from the parts counter. She told me that the car takes 0w20, so that when I do my own oil changes, that's what I should use. Then, after I left the dealership, I looked at the sticker they put on the window to remind me of my next oil change. The sticker said 5w20. So, I called her and asked about the discrepancy between what the sticker said and what she told me at the dealership. She checked with the service techs, and it turns out she was wrong, and the car does take 5w20.



She is supposed to call me today with clarification as to why I should NOT put synthetic. I'll report back what she tells me.
 
#13 ·
The owners manual for the 2018 makes no mention of conventional vs. synthetic. I just specifies the oil weight based on which engine you have. All it says is, and I quote, "For maintenance service, Mazda recommends Mazda Genuine Parts and Castrol® (U.S.A. only)."
 
#15 ·
Interesting re the naturally (normally) aspirated 2.5: they recommend 0W-20 (I know some of you believe otherwise... set that aside for a moment)... I may be wrong here but I don't think you can get 0W-20 in a conventional... only a synthetic. Effectively they are asking for a synthetic for the less stressed engine but don't care re the turbo haha. Makes no sense.

Regardless, view under the valve cover of any modern day engine to see how darkly burnished (brown) the surfaces are in an engine that has run conventional oil versus how much less so a synthetic. Engines these days run HOT and tend to sludge making the synthetic a no-brainer. YMMV but i know what I will do!
 
#17 ·
Regardless, view under the valve cover of any modern day engine to see how darkly burnished (brown) the surfaces are in an engine that has run conventional oil versus how much less so a synthetic. Engines these days run HOT and tend to sludge making the synthetic a no-brainer. YMMV but i know what I will do!
Like i mentioned earlier, it has little to do with synthetic VS. non synthetic, but the actual quality of the oil. Many synthetics are actually just a semi synthetic blend - dino base with additives poured in that make it considered "synthetic."

I don't see how sludge has anything to do with hotter engine temperatures. the hotter an engine runs, the more it thins out the oil which theoretically should prolong the duration until engine oil starts to sludge. since DI motors tend to shear the engine oil with fuel that should make it even more resistant to sludge forming. Plus, the NA Skyactiv motor actually runs quite cool especially for a modern engine. Turbo engines naturally run hotter, but not by much.

The turbo engine specifies 5w30 oil because the turbo itself requires a thicker film of oil to maintain protection, reduce the amount of oil consumption via the turbo and also protect the rest of the engine internals from the added stress of the turbo. 5W30 is just enough protection for the turbo engine to get it through the warranty period, and 0W20 is just enough protection for the NA engine.

Bottom line, don't be scared to use thicker oil, make sure you are using good quality oil (ie NOT Mobil 1) and be very sure to change the oil often.
 
#16 ·
Oh, and sludging has various causes - but heat can play a role when said pieces of sludge want to break free. Aside from the need to STILL do frequent oil changes when driving conditions or useage patterns could cause sludge (equally-regardless of you running conventional versus synthetic) - synthetic will have you faring better off re sludge than a conventional!
 
#18 ·
Ask anyone with the undersized oil filter and the originally mfr-spec'd under-performer oil... in an early Passat 1.8T. Sludging was a major issue in that engine (toasted many) 'till vw smartened up and made the filter size bigger and called for much higher-spec'd oil.
 
#19 ·
Speaking of filter size, I purchased a new oil filter for my 2018 6 2.5T at the dealership and I was surprised how small it was. It looks about the same size that I have on my twin cylinder lawn tractor and on my twin cylinder Harley. I questioned the kid behind the parts counter if he gave me the correct filter, and he said yes. I just seems really small.
 
#22 ·
The NON-TURBO should use 0w20.

The TURBO should use FULL SYNTHETIC 5w30.

There are NO non-synthetic 0w20s, so any is fine (Mobil 1, Pennzoil, Valvoline, etc.)

5w30s MUST be full synthetic. The reason is BOTH due to the high temperature in the turbo (which will coke the oil) AND the close distance from the fire deck of the top compression ring on ALL modern engines (which will ALSO coke the oil.)

Use a dino oil and you WILL get sludging on modern engines. Don't do it, use a full synthetic. You NEED the additional temperature range on all modern engines.

The issue with turbo engines is that the turbo seal is NOT an actual seal; it's a labyrinth passage, and the weight of the oil must be sufficient for it to be slung outward and thus NOT seep through the turbo. 0w20 is too thin. 5w30 is ok. Thus the 5w30 is REQUIRED in turbo engines. You give up some mileage and there is no problem with engine clearances with 0w20, but if you use it in a turbo engine you will find that you take excessive oil consumption as a result of bypass at the turbocharger shaft.
 
#23 ·
The issue with turbo engines is that the turbo seal is NOT an actual seal; it's a labyrinth passage, and the weight of the oil must be sufficient for it to be slung outward and thus NOT seep through the turbo. 0w20 is too thin. 5w30 is ok. Thus the 5w30 is REQUIRED in turbo engines.
The truth is, 5W30 is just merely "OK."

The most important part of a good engine oil is the additive package. a good blend of additives makes the oil more resistant to fuel shear thus taking longer to break down. If you drive in a hot climate and run the engine through it's paces, or you're noticing oil consumption in particular do not hesitate to use 5W40 or even 5W50. When it comes to any engine, you want the oil to be as thick as possible for it to generously fill the engine's clearances but flow well and quickly reach the cylinder-head for proper lubrication on cold starts. this is especially important with turbo engines because of what Ticker said. The Skyactiv's engine clearances are good for up to 10W50 which implies a very high performance design. While an oil this thick is best left for track use, what I am trying to say is that with this engine in particular thinner oil is not better oil. To summarize:

5W30 - Cold weather
5W40 - "All-season"
5W50 - Aggressive driving, hot weather
10W50 - Track use
 
#27 ·
There are different formulas for Mobil 1. If you are using the "Euro" Formula you are using one the top rated oils. Period.

@Get Inline perhaps you should educate the boys over on the BMW forum. The Mobile 1 Euro blend is rated ACEA A3/B4 or C3. It is the top rating possible and by far the best oil for a turbo(s).
 
#28 ·
The last thing those BMW enthusiasts need is more education. There are actually quite a few who swear by it, but many say you can't possibly put anything worse short of canola oil into your crankcase. After seeing a couple threads of this weird thick chocolate milk looking stuff in the crankcase when using Mobil 1 that's all that was needed to convince me.
 
#29 ·
I have used Mobil-1 for years and have had ZERO engine issues. In fact, most people who drain my oil remark that I could have went another 5000mi on it based on color alone. Naturally, I won't because most of the additives have been used up by the time I get the oil changed. I've used Mobil-1 exclusively on the last 3 cars I've owned and never had burn, leak or sludge issues on ANY of them. Period.

FWIW I run the "Asian" High-Efficiency green label Mobil-1 in my Mazda and it does just fine. As far as BMW owners, you can't tell them anything. Most of them think that because they own a German rendition of a Ford that they're better than most. Seem to carry that attitude with them on the highway, where they think they should be given open berth to all lanes.
 
#33 ·
The colour of oil or how it looks means practically nothing. Just because it looks dirty doesn't mean it hasn't been sheared yet and cannot protect the engine's internals any longer. A more important criteria, especially when it comes to DI motors is how the oil actually smells. You will smell the fuel in the oil, and if it gives off a pungent smell that is a strong indication that the oil needs to be changed.

BMW's? being a rendition of a Ford? What on earth are you talking about? I'll refrain from being rude this time because you've clearly never driven a BMW. Seems like you just use the stereotype of a bunch of bad drivers to formulate your opinion on the brand of a whole which is incredibly stupid and ignorant. How could you blame the brand if it's drivers are the ones that are often dickheads? Plus, i've ran into lots of BMW owners that are quite skilled and actually good drivers. Their inline 6 engines are fantastic, transmission tuning is impeccable, chassis feels eerily similar to the Mazda 6, but RWD and more refined/luxurious. You just keep on doing your thing and portraying the image of a Mobil 1 using dickhead.

Which Motul 5w30 would you suggest? I used amsoil signature for my 2014 but i see that its ACAE A5/B5 not A3/B4.
Amsoil also sells a european formula 5w30 which is A3/B4 so I may check that one out also.
This one here:

https://germanparts.ca/parts/773601...Z3r3-Ag01G4XDys2PhzczVFnzGCx9qFxoCgJEQAvD_BwE

If you end up using it, You should make a post about it comparing it to whatever oil you've used in the past. You will definitely feel a difference it is great stuff.
 
#34 ·
Waste of Money ^^^^

If you want to use the best oil for your engine, 2.5T this is what to buy and use. The price is less than half of what has been recommended and a better oil. There are 1 or 2 others that are as good but nothing better.

Drain the oil, replace the filter and dump the "Jug" in. Perfect amount. no checking the dipstick. Be happy.

[ame]https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01M266FWZ?aaxitk=.jqZ1Q-UuhXmP157JO94Pw&pd_rd_i=B01M266FWZ&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_p=54dc821a-0937-4e6f-9da9-f8dd5443145d&pf_rd_s=desktop-sx-top-slot&pf_rd_t=301&pf_rd_i=pennzoil+ultra+platinum+5w30&hsa_cr_id=1367418130301&sb-ci-n=asinImage&sb-ci-v=https%3A%2F%2Fimages-na.ssl-images-amazon.com%2Fimages%2FI%2F512UNwtqGxL.jpg&sb-ci-a=B01M266FWZ[/ame]
 
#35 ·
Waste of Money ^^^^
And how did you come to this conclusion? Because you've tried using this oil before in the past, let alone actually done some sort of research on why it's so good?

Yes it's pricey, but it's worth every last penny. It is incredibly resistant to fuel shear meaning it protects your engine better toward the end of your oil change interval which means you can run this oil for longer offsetting the extra chump change you put towards it initially during your oil change. The Pennzoil Platinum you linked in your post is also great stuff, but please don't comment about things you have absolutely zero information on or any sort of personal experience.
 
#39 ·
So, here is an update....


The dealership never called me back to explain why I shouldn't use synthetic in my 2.5T. So, I decided to email an acquaintance who happens to be the midwest regional manager for Customer Experience, Retention, and Owner Loyalty for MNAO. He forwarded my question to their technical department. This was their response:


For the turbo SkyActiv engines we require a heavier oil of 5W-30 that meets the typical GF-5 and SN standards. Both synthetic and conventional oils out there meet these standards so it really is up to the customer to decide if they want synthetic or not. The statement below that we “do not” recommend synthetic 5W-30 is bogus as I personally WOULD recommend the synthetic oil.


Case closed... at least from Mazda's take on this.
 
#40 ·
Case closed... at least from Mazda's take on this.
Seems like it's a great time to close this thread up also, since your question was answered, and I've seen enough posts about oil this past 4-6 weeks that it's causing me to throw up a little everytime I see that word...

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk
 
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