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post #11 of 76 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 12:49 PM Thread Starter
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jcme0557 -
Most of my tire experience is 5-10 years old and dealt with different cars and different driving. It's important to remember that tire technology is racing forward and many things may have changed.
That said, I feel Michelin are overpriced for value/performance and you're buying a well-marketed name. Fine product, but there may be better, cheaper alternatives.

In your case, not sure what kind of driving you're doing. If it's work driving, and lots of it, how much are you zoom-zooming around? Is it highways? City? Suburbia/rural?

Personally, I am very happy to give up some high-end performance for more reassurance I won't slide off the road in heavy rain or if I get caught out in snow and ice.

Again, my personal opinion, but if I drove my new tires (barely a performance tire) at anything like their capability, I'd have the cops chasing me and neighbors throwing rocks at me. All of the street driving I've personally experienced in the last couple of years offers so few opportunities for safe high-performance driving, it's not worth it: too much traffic, inattentive traffic, crowded roads, low speed limits, bicyclists, runners, texting drivers, frequent red lights, heavy trucks, etc.

I'm willing to compromise my high-end a bunch for comfort and safety on the lower end. If I can only take a turn at 90%, that's no harm. If I screw up in bad weather or something, I want the tire to catch me so I don't damage my car, myself, or uninvolved people.

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post #12 of 76 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 02:28 PM
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Originally Posted by jcme0557 View Post
Thanks for posting your experience with your new tires. I'm going to be needing tires soon too...so, I was interested in what you had to say. I will probably go with a set of all-season tires, due to the fact that I seem to travel all over the country at all times of the year and my needs are such that it doesn't make sense for me to invest in two sets of wheels/tires for the same vehicle.



The two tires on my short list are: the Michelin Pilot A/S3+ or the Conti ExtremeContact A/S DWS 06.



Right now, I'm leaning towards the Continentals. They are about $25 cheaper a piece and I've had pretty good luck with Conti's over the years. I do hear they are biased more towards the "touring" side of the Sport-Touring performance spectrum. I like a good responsive tire, so that has me wondering. Continentals also seem to get noisier as they wear. The Pilot A/S3+ might have the edge - performance-wise - but I don't know if that is enough to matter to me? Honestly, I've not been overwhelmed with the Michelin products I've bought in the last few years. I guess for the premium price, I'm expecting to be completely "wowed" and am not. Or, maybe its impossible for them to live up to all the hype? I don't know, but I have found them to be harsh-riding over sharp impacts and not nearly as nice as everyone says. I mean they were decent tires. However, at the price premium you pay, I was expecting to be blown away and instead found them to have some niggling little flaws that seemed inexcusable in a tire costing so much more than it's competition.

I've owned both the DWS06 and the A/S 3+. It's a matter of preference. The Contis definitely offer more steering feedback and are more tactile on the road. However, I can also confirm that they do get noisier with wear. You can start noticing it at about 5/32. The Michelins are very grippy and have a more compliant ride but you lose a lot of wheel feedback. Then there's the cost difference. On that end, if you watch Discount/America's Tire they have regular promotions which offer $70 off a set. You can also get additional rebates if you use their 0% financing. Having said all that, I would give the DWS06 the edge.
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post #13 of 76 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 03:40 PM
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Originally Posted by jcme0557 View Post
Thanks for posting your experience with your new tires. I'm going to be needing tires soon too...so, I was interested in what you had to say. I will probably go with a set of all-season tires, due to the fact that I seem to travel all over the country at all times of the year and my needs are such that it doesn't make sense for me to invest in two sets of wheels/tires for the same vehicle.



The two tires on my short list are: the Michelin Pilot A/S3+ or the Conti ExtremeContact A/S DWS 06.



Right now, I'm leaning towards the Continentals. They are about $25 cheaper a piece and I've had pretty good luck with Conti's over the years. I do hear they are biased more towards the "touring" side of the Sport-Touring performance spectrum. I like a good responsive tire, so that has me wondering. Continentals also seem to get noisier as they wear. The Pilot A/S3+ might have the edge - performance-wise - but I don't know if that is enough to matter to me? Honestly, I've not been overwhelmed with the Michelin products I've bought in the last few years. I guess for the premium price, I'm expecting to be completely "wowed" and am not. Or, maybe its impossible for them to live up to all the hype? I don't know, but I have found them to be harsh-riding over sharp impacts and not nearly as nice as everyone says. I mean they were decent tires. However, at the price premium you pay, I was expecting to be blown away and instead found them to have some niggling little flaws that seemed inexcusable in a tire costing so much more than it's competition.
I'd suggest looking into Yokohama. They pair very well to Mazda's chassis.

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Originally Posted by michael95350 View Post
I've owned both the DWS06 and the A/S 3+. It's a matter of preference. The Contis definitely offer more steering feedback and are more tactile on the road. However, I can also confirm that they do get noisier with wear. You can start noticing it at about 5/32. The Michelins are very grippy and have a more compliant ride but you lose a lot of wheel feedback. Then there's the cost difference. On that end, if you watch Discount/America's Tire they have regular promotions which offer $70 off a set. You can also get additional rebates if you use their 0% financing. Having said all that, I would give the DWS06 the edge.
Totally agree with you on the comment about Michellins. They were really lacking steering feel/precision for me. I don't see them as anything special to deserve the price premium or the hype. I found them to feel particularly bland and inndifferent when paired with Mazda's chassis. I have Pilot Super Sport's on my BMW and other than the downright horrific treadwear, they are fantastic tires. The rear tires, which are 265 width (RWD car) went from 90 to 50% tread in just over 1000KM of spirited driving. Only problem is they are dangerous if pushed hard before getting some proper heat into them.
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post #14 of 76 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 06:10 PM
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BMWs are notoriously hard on tires. One of my clients has a 5 series and says despite everything he's tried, he can't get over 15K mileage out of the tires. He's not an aggressive driver either (with the Bimmer anyhow, different story on his pro-stock 68 Camaro and pro-drag 66 Chevelle)
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post #15 of 76 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 06:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michael95350 View Post
BMWs are notoriously hard on tires. One of my clients has a 5 series and says despite everything he's tried, he can't get over 15K mileage out of the tires. He's not an aggressive driver either (with the Bimmer anyhow, different story on his pro-stock 68 Camaro and pro-drag 66 Chevelle)
Front's or rears? BMW's rear tires have very aggressive rear negative camber, like -1.8 degrees. If you drive too softly or take off from lights like a madman when the inner part of the tire has the most contact with the road, they will wear unevenly. As long as you keep your driving spirited, they will wear evenly. I never had an issue with short tread wear when I was using regular all seasons.
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post #16 of 76 (permalink) Old 08-21-2018, 07:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michael95350 View Post
I've owned both the DWS06 and the A/S 3+. It's a matter of preference. The Contis definitely offer more steering feedback and are more tactile on the road. However, I can also confirm that they do get noisier with wear. You can start noticing it at about 5/32. The Michelins are very grippy and have a more compliant ride but you lose a lot of wheel feedback. Then there's the cost difference. On that end, if you watch Discount/America's Tire they have regular promotions which offer $70 off a set. You can also get additional rebates if you use their 0% financing. Having said all that, I would give the DWS06 the edge.
My experience with 3 sets of the Conti DWS (4th set on my 2018) have been the same. The Contis do wear faster than I like but Iíve offset their cost a little more by getting a prorated credit on them. They have never made it within 10K miles of their 50K. By that time they do get louder but no where as bad as the OEM tires. And at least they handle better worn than the Dunlopís did new. And the price factor versus Michelin, IMO the Michelins arenít worth the extra money for the small increase in performance or comfort. Even tho the Contis wear faster, if you get them at discount, with a promo, theyíre great tires for the price.

My argument for an A/S tire even if you have separate winter rims.... Dedicated high performance summer tires donít always like cooler weather. My experience has been that around 40C, they loose performance because the rubber isnít as flexible. And that gets worse exponentially on wet roads. A ďhigh performance, A/SĒ like the Contis will give me all the performance I need for the 6 and still perform well in colder temps. Iím in NC so 3-4 months out of the year, itís a concern. When I was in PA, Oct thru Apr was questionable.

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post #17 of 76 (permalink) Old 08-21-2018, 09:43 AM
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Originally Posted by MazdaRex View Post
jcme0557 -
Most of my tire experience is 5-10 years old and dealt with different cars and different driving. It's important to remember that tire technology is racing forward and many things may have changed.
That said, I feel Michelin are overpriced for value/performance and you're buying a well-marketed name. Fine product, but there may be better, cheaper alternatives.
I have to agree with you about on this one. While still good tires, the most recent Michelins I've bought have not justified their price vs. the competition.
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In your case, not sure what kind of driving you're doing. If it's work driving, and lots of it, how much are you zoom-zooming around? Is it highways? City? Suburbia/rural?
I do all sorts of driving - from twisty back roads to interstate cruising. I like a tire that responds quickly and tracks true, but I'll trade ultimate grip for decent mileage and good rain traction.


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Personally, I am very happy to give up some high-end performance for more reassurance I won't slide off the road in heavy rain or if I get caught out in snow and ice.
Exactly!

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Originally Posted by MazdaRex View Post
I'm willing to compromise my high-end a bunch for comfort and safety on the lower end. If I can only take a turn at 90%, that's no harm. If I screw up in bad weather or something, I want the tire to catch me so I don't damage my car, myself, or uninvolved people.
90% is pretty good. I can live with that. Honestly, tire technology is SO good now, that its almost impossible to safely test the extremes of performance on anything but a race track. Unfortunately, this often means there is much less margin between traction and no-traction than there used to be. You can get in real trouble before you know it.


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post #18 of 76 (permalink) Old 08-21-2018, 10:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trippp View Post
My argument for an A/S tire even if you have separate winter rims.... Dedicated high performance summer tires donít always like cooler weather. My experience has been that around 40C, they loose performance because the rubber isnít as flexible. And that gets worse exponentially on wet roads. A ďhigh performance, A/SĒ like the Contis will give me all the performance I need for the 6 and still perform well in colder temps. Iím in NC so 3-4 months out of the year, itís a concern. When I was in PA, Oct thru Apr was questionable.
Completely agree. I'm in Michigan, and I always run winter tires/wheels (usually from about early December -- mid-March). I run all-seasons the rest of the time, because snow/sleet/cold rain/wet leaves are still issues Oct-Dec and March-May.

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post #19 of 76 (permalink) Old 08-21-2018, 11:26 AM
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Some very good points raised in this thread; thanks to all for sharing. My main takeaway from this and a few other threads is that the 19" OEM Dunlops are less-than-optimal (to be nice). I just took a road trip back and forth across the PA Turnpike: now, I don't push my car to the limit, but as far as handling in wet and dry, I didn't feel like the Dunlops let me down. Of course, I have no other tire to compare it to on this car. The Mazda6 always felt sure-footed even around some of those crazy turnpike bends at 75MPH. However, the road noise at times seems pretty harsh - and if going to a new set of Contis will reduce that noise significantly then that alone could be a good reason for me to make the swap early. I only have about 7K on the tires so far.

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post #20 of 76 (permalink) Old 08-22-2018, 10:19 AM
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My main takeaway from this and a few other threads is that the 19" OEM Dunlops are less-than-optimal (to be nice). I just took a road trip back and forth across the PA Turnpike: now, I don't push my car to the limit, but as far as handling in wet and dry, I didn't feel like the Dunlops let me down. Of course, I have no other tire to compare it to on this car. The Mazda6 always felt sure-footed even around some of those crazy turnpike bends at 75MPH. However, the road noise at times seems pretty harsh - and if going to a new set of Contis will reduce that noise significantly then that alone could be a good reason for me to make the swap early. I only have about 7K on the tires so far.

Honestly, I am somewhat baffled by all the negative comments the stock Dunlops get. Mine have been pretty good for OEM tires. (If you want an example of a bad OEM tire - Bridgestone. I will never buy anything with Bridgestone tires on it.) My Dunlops handle well, have worn perfectly, are not slick in the rain, or super horrible in the snow. They may be noisy, but I wouldn't be able to tell too much unless driven back to back with another tire...and, a lot of tires get louder as they wear.



I wonder if there are two different sources or manufacturing entities for this tire?


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