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post #1 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-11-2019, 09:15 PM Thread Starter
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Screwed up a coil pack change

OK....I took some peeps advice and changed out my coil packs and plugs on this 04 Mazda 6 Wagon I bought last fall . The car has 97K miles. Previously I found out the precat near the fire wall (bank 2?) had puked out its guts into the second cat. I had new primary cats installed and the second cat hollowed out and my mileade still sucked. I've been gettin 16-17 around town and 22 highway (at 60-65). Power seemed OK, but still not as peppy as my "old" 04 wagon with 170K miles. There were no CELs or codes pending (I have a cheap Bluetooth OBD II scanner), but I thought the coils & plugs might be tired. I bought new coils & plugs and after reading may write ups I change them. After digging into it I realized that it must have been done recently. The coil packs looked pretty clean and the spark plugs looked like good (no carbon, no oil). I figured since I had it apart I might as well put the new stuff in. Also, it seemed pretty straightforward so I did the EGR valve mod. Finally, there was some oil in the intake pipe (enough to drizzle out) so I replaced the PCV valve (I read plugging is the typical failure, but maybe it was letting too much oil through.

On to the issue. When I stared the car it ran rough. It almost feels like its not firing on one cylinder. Throttle response is slow and choppy if i reve it a bit. You can feel the roughness when accelerating, especially from a stop. I called it quits last night about 11:00. Tonight I popped the hood and had my son reve the motor while I listened. most of the time when you hit the gas there's a noticeable whooshing sound followed by a chuffing. After letting off the gas there is a rattle near the fire wall. Ir may actually be coming from the motor (could it be the PCV valve?). I have triple checked all the hoses, and plugs. THere are no CELs, which if there was a misfire I thought one would pop up.

I am lost. Thanks to anyone who has read all the way through this post. I am looking for any advice besides "STOP WORKING ON YOUR OWN CAR!" which honestly I am considering. My High mileage six wagon has been one of the best cars I've ever owned. This one is more like the poster child for a used car lemon law.
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post #2 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-11-2019, 09:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calvin View Post
OK....I took some peeps advice and changed out my coil packs and plugs on this 04 Mazda 6 Wagon I bought last fall . The car has 97K miles. Previously I found out the precat near the fire wall (bank 2?) had puked out its guts into the second cat. I had new primary cats installed and the second cat hollowed out and my mileade still sucked. I've been gettin 16-17 around town and 22 highway (at 60-65). Power seemed OK, but still not as peppy as my "old" 04 wagon with 170K miles. There were no CELs or codes pending (I have a cheap Bluetooth OBD II scanner), but I thought the coils & plugs might be tired. I bought new coils & plugs and after reading may write ups I change them. After digging into it I realized that it must have been done recently. The coil packs looked pretty clean and the spark plugs looked like good (no carbon, no oil). I figured since I had it apart I might as well put the new stuff in. Also, it seemed pretty straightforward so I did the EGR valve mod. Finally, there was some oil in the intake pipe (enough to drizzle out) so I replaced the PCV valve (I read plugging is the typical failure, but maybe it was letting too much oil through.

On to the issue. When I stared the car it ran rough. It almost feels like its not firing on one cylinder. Throttle response is slow and choppy if i reve it a bit. You can feel the roughness when accelerating, especially from a stop. I called it quits last night about 11:00. Tonight I popped the hood and had my son reve the motor while I listened. most of the time when you hit the gas there's a noticeable whooshing sound followed by a chuffing. After letting off the gas there is a rattle near the fire wall. Ir may actually be coming from the motor (could it be the PCV valve?). I have triple checked all the hoses, and plugs. THere are no CELs, which if there was a misfire I thought one would pop up.

I am lost. Thanks to anyone who has read all the way through this post. I am looking for any advice besides "STOP WORKING ON YOUR OWN CAR!" which honestly I am considering. My High mileage six wagon has been one of the best cars I've ever owned. This one is more like the poster child for a used car lemon law.

Is everything plugged in correctly coils/anything you unplugged while diagnosing this? When I had my misfire, it was bad the three bank 2 cylinders were pretty much not doing anything, I NEVER got a CEL. This might be a long shot, but have you checked for any vacuum leaks?

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post #3 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-11-2019, 09:50 PM Thread Starter
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Hey Blue Devil...Second time you have given me advice. Thanks. I was convinced I had a bad coil or coil connection until I heard what I can best describe as the air sucking sound. I checked all the hoses again along with the flex pile connecting the air filter to the TB and it all looks fine. My next step is to unplug the three exposed coil packs on at a time to see if it makes any difference (I assume if I unplug one that is working it will get worse). I am trying to avoid taking the plenham off again, but it may come to that. The problem is if they all look OK, how do I diagnose if one of the coils packs on bank #2 is bad? I guess I could put the originals back and see if it resolves the issue. If not, I will really be hating my life.
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post #4 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-11-2019, 11:02 PM
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you can test the resistance on the coils I actually did this even before I had the FSM and found that the three bad coils were wayyyy off from the others, but here's the proper method from the FSM
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2007 6 Hatch 3.0 V6 ATX

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To Come lowering springs, sway bars, subframe brace, strut tower brace
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post #5 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-11-2019, 11:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calvin View Post
Hey Blue Devil...Second time you have given me advice. Thanks. I was convinced I had a bad coil or coil connection until I heard what I can best describe as the air sucking sound. I checked all the hoses again along with the flex pile connecting the air filter to the TB and it all looks fine. My next step is to unplug the three exposed coil packs on at a time to see if it makes any difference (I assume if I unplug one that is working it will get worse). I am trying to avoid taking the plenham off again, but it may come to that. The problem is if they all look OK, how do I diagnose if one of the coils packs on bank #2 is bad? I guess I could put the originals back and see if it resolves the issue. If not, I will really be hating my life.

I have walked the catalytic converter road. When my converters dissolved they also filled up the secondary converters. I replaced the "pre-cats" and blew through the downstream converters and all was "okay" for about 20 months. I started to develop a misfire (had new coils and plugs) and power was down from never really being full.
In my case the semi-clogged downstream converters caused early failure of my "pre-cats" and one of my banks was plugged. This would prevent me running optimally.


I'm not saying this is your issue but it may expand your line of thinking a bit.
https://forum.mazda6club.com/3-0l-v6...ml#post4809001


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post #6 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-12-2019, 12:47 AM
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@DrFeelGood and @bluedevil6

With all of these problems I'm hearing about, wouldn't it just be cheaper to get rid of all the cats before it absolutely kills you?


I'm still learning though, bear with me &#x1f61b;
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post #7 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-12-2019, 01:12 AM
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@DrFeelGood and @bluedevil6

With all of these problems I'm hearing about, wouldn't it just be cheaper to get rid of all the cats before it absolutely kills you?


I'm still learning though, bear with me &#x1f61b;
I really don't mean to drone on those cats.
Yes @SlowCarFast it would likely be better from an engineering perspective however I am still residing in one of those places where we collectively believe the Earth can still be saved. Omitting the converters is not really an option. Even buying new converters(4), O2 sensors(4), and coils(6) and plugs(6) still only adds up to about 3-4 car payments.


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post #8 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-12-2019, 09:02 AM
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Screwed up a coil pack change

Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowCarFast View Post
@DrFeelGood and @bluedevil6

With all of these problems I'm hearing about, wouldn't it just be cheaper to get rid of all the cats before it absolutely kills you?


I'm still learning though, bear with me


It would be cheaper that was the original reason I got rid of them, to keep from killing the car. On that note if you’re concerned about the environment as @DrFeelGood mentioned you could consider something along the lines of the magnaflow universal cats or even their high flow universal cats.

My thinking here is you could eliminate the precats and use the universal ones in place of the secondary cats you would still have converters but they are much cheaper to buy. The magnaflow (and keep in mind you could go with something cheaper) universal cat is $122 at autozone



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post #9 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-12-2019, 11:43 AM
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Have you checked the intake accordion hose for tears? They hide in the creases and do all the things you have described. They're easy to miss, and old ones tear easily. Also, pcv hoses can tear and do the same things.

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post #10 of 15 (permalink) Old 02-12-2019, 12:45 PM
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@bluedevil6 brings up a good alternative. I went that route with my Toyota AE102 but it was OBD1 and did not have pre/post cat O2 sensors. The only way that would work for me is to have a simulator that fools the computer into thinking all is still there when it connected at inspection.


Had I known about it before I may have had a wild enough hair to replace the sub-frame, oil pan/dipstick, and exhaust to the later Mk1.5 were the routing was changed to mitigate this issue.


The problem is sucking that catalyst stuff in and that should be handled with an EGR modification.


To reiterate what @GerryB said, go with induction issues first. A vacuum leak is most likely (happens readily with the plastics and rubber used in the 6) and will be the cheapest and "easiest" to fix.


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