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Brake issues at 35K! Anuone else?

51K views 128 replies 53 participants last post by  Jimal 
#1 ·
I got my 2014 6 Sport automatic last July. I drive a good deal for my work so I am already at 35K miles. At 30,000 miles my brakes started fading/vibrating at 30,000 miles likes the rotors were warped. I took the car to the dealer yesterday and they confirmed the front rotors had a slight issue and that they could turn and balance them. Of course this will cost $220 to do all 4 rotors and rotors are only covered under warranty for the first 12,000 miles. This really pissed me off. I am not hard on my brakes. Most of my miles are freeway miles and the tech said freeway miles is hard on rotors. A car that is 10 months old should not have rotor issues! Has anyone else had this issue?
 
#3 ·
I live in a small town and generally don't brake too hard... maybe to avoid pets. Maybe.

The previous 3 vehicles I've owned (96 BMW 328, 03 Nissan Maxima, 13 Mazda 3) have never had warped rotors, despite travelling almost 180,000 miles between them. I am the only driver of all of my cars.

However the 14 Mazda 6 has been in the shop twice for warped rotors in less than a year. As I drive I can feel them start to warp, and eventually have to take the vehicle in to have them replaced (the stealer has owned up so far). Now with 11,000 miles on the clock, they are warped a 3rd time.

I've torqued and re-torqued the wheels after the first replacement, in case for some reason the wheel torque is the culprit.

I suspect this to be a cooling issue, as well as the size/material of the rotors. Perhaps the focus was on reducing drag to the point where airflow in the wheel area has been minimized, allowing runaway temps after a couple of stops. Interesting to note, the second warping occurred in winter.

I also have a vibrating half-shaft, though I don't think this has anything to do with it (warranty issue).

As I stated at the start, I generally do a lot of driving and have owned many vehicles over the years. This is the only vehicle aside from my 93 Grand Am (don't ask) to have rotors that have warped.

Interesting to note, not everybody seems to be having these problems. Don't pay attention to the posters that say "U BRAKE TO SOONN LOL AND HARD." There's an issue on some cars here...
 
#5 ·
As a driver you certainly can make the rotors warp, but that doesn't mean it's the only cause.

Those who are heavy on the brakes or who like to coat or drive them them slightly engaged are much more prone to having them warp or wear funny than people who don't slam them and don't let them heat up too much. New brakes are especially sensitive to using them too rough.

Perhaps the vehicles you guys got were test cars rather than show room only, and the people who tested them weren't the nicest.
 
#6 · (Edited)
Brake rotors are almost-NEVER actually warped.

Show me the runout on your so-called "warped" rotor. Betcha it's non-existent.

What happens is that they're not properly bedded after being replaced (or when new.) If you drive patiently and don't get 'em hot for a good long while (1,000 miles or more, sometimes quite a bit more if you're mostly-highway driving!) then they will transfer material from the pad to the rotor evenly out of normal driving and all is ok.

HOWEVER, if not..... well, then you got problems because if you get an uneven transfer that spot will have more friction, which will lead to it getting hotter there locally, which leads to even more transfer and eventually you get a crystalline change in the rotor on a local basis and now you get the pulsing pedal that won't go away unless you turn or replace the rotor.

But it's not warped.

How do you avoid this? Either don't get the brakes hot for a good thousand miles after they're replaced or reworked or DO get them intentionally hot and bed them in properly. The latter requires a place where you can do that without risk of having to stop in the middle of the process, because if you do you're going to wind up right back where you started with the same problem. Finding a place where you can do that can be challenging if you live in a major metro area; it requires being able to do several 70-20 quick (threshold braking) brake applications in close succession but NOT coming to a complete stop until the brakes COMPLETELY cool down (which will take 15-20 minutes with no brake use at moderate highway speeds!) when you're done. If you are forced to stop while they're hot during this process you're hosed, so careful consideration of where you do this BEFORE you do it is important.

If you do it right there will be a visible dark and even deposit of pad material on the entire surface of the rotor when you're finished. You'll notice materially-better brake performance too.

I make a practice of bedding in my brakes whenever I change them or on a new car immediately, and the only times I've run into this problem over the years is when I didn't.
 
#8 ·
I've had the same problem with all of my Mazda's. My 2012 V6 6, 2010 Mazda3, 2007 CX-7 --- Rotors get to the point of a nasty vibration or grinding, brake pads done in 10K miles. I'm taking my 2014 back to the dealer for more warranty work regarding the brake rotors and pads because now they make the same grinding noise my 2012 Mazda6 did.

EVERY Mazda I've had has had warped rotors.


We really need to find some larger rotors and better pads for the 2014 6. I'm still under warranty because they were replaced first before the 1yr/12K
 
#10 ·
0.6mm maybe. I had 0.25" of runout once when I clipped a curb after hitting an oil patch mid turn at 30MPH... 3,500lbs of pressure into one area about the size of your forearm. The rear wheel could NOT be turned by hand. New axle, rotor, and wheel later.. good to go. (can you believe the tire survived that?! LOL).

I also have to agree with Ticker on break-in. That method has always been amazing to me. The brakes on my other car get ABUSED, and are running very aggressive pads. 50K miles later, the rotors and pads are still good, and the front rotors were turned to as thin as spec allowed when I put the new pads on. (71K miles on the OEM rotors at that point). No shudder yet, and with such a thin rotor warping should've been a MAJOR concern of mine.
 
#14 ·
To the OP. I'm at 36K and my breaks are pulsing. I was going in this week for the recall, and having Mazda check the breaks. It happened to me at about 27K also. Mazda turned the rotors under warranty so no cost to me. I really miss my 6 speed manual, I never had to see the breaks until 50K. My motorcycle's the same way. No challenge with the breaks because I compression (engine) break so often. I'm going to have to try using manual mode and engine braking with that.
 
#19 ·
May I ask, were you missing you rotary phone back in mid-2000s when phones where not touch screen, but had button? Did you not hated how the paint on the button would fade/chip from use?
 
#15 ·
I got my 2014 6 Sport automatic last July. I drive a good deal for my work so I am already at 35K miles. At 30,000 miles my brakes started fading/vibrating at 30,000 miles likes the rotors were warped. I took the car to the dealer yesterday and they confirmed the front rotors had a slight issue and that they could turn and balance them. Of course this will cost $220 to do all 4 rotors and rotors are only covered under warranty for the first 12,000 miles. This really pissed me off. I am not hard on my brakes. Most of my miles are freeway miles and the tech said freeway miles is hard on rotors. A car that is 10 months old should not have rotor issues! Has anyone else had this issue?
Please, Accords forever had 10-12k miles brake life expectancy, after which rotors needed t be turned/replaced. BMWs are similar. 30k miles is fine
 
#21 ·
My wife's Hyundai is at 68k with the OE brakes and rotors. They started to grind when they were cold in the winter and the wet, no loss of stopping power from what I can tell. I inspected all of them about 2 months ago and they had a lot of life left in them. I would hate to think that her car has better equipment (by apparent leaps and bounds) than my fine Mazda piece of automotive mastery.
 
#23 · (Edited)
I can beat that. I swapped out my wifes brake pads on her cobalt at 90K miles (that she bought brand new!) because of shuddering from the rotors. I had the rotors turned and life goes on. The shocking part? The OEM brakes were still well within spec and no where near the replacement mark. Still over 1/2" thick of pad material!! Can you imagine? 90K miles on the OEM brakes.. and it could've gone much further had I not gone ahead and replaced them when I got the rotors turned down. And honestly.. braking power was worse with the new o-reilly pads than the OEM stuff that was 90K old LOL. (We were listing it up for sale, I was just making everything OK.. otherwise it would've gotten hawk pads LOL)

I guess I'm just happy that at 26K all I need is tires, and that's not even really a NEED. I'm just not 100% comfortable with them in wet conditions anymore *shrug*
 
#24 · (Edited)
To elaborate on the auto vs manual impact on brake life it isn't just engine braking that makes a difference (shouldn't do that anyways, what is cheaper? new brakes or new clutch and transmission by shifting twice as much?)

The other two reasons brakes last longer on MTX cars is because the cars are lighter (a very small difference) and because they don't have to overcome the torque converter braking to a complete stop, which is a huge contributor to wear especially those who do stop and go traffic. Although stop and go traffic would equally trash your clutch so its no win situation there. Really, put your auto in neutral and brake to zero then put it in gear and try braking again applying the brake pedal the same amount and you will carry substantially farther down the road.
 
#25 ·
The other two reasons brakes last longer on MTX cars is because the cars are lighter (a very small difference) and because they don't have to overcome the torque converter braking to a complete stop, which is a huge contributor to wear especially those who do stop and go traffic. Although stop and go traffic would equally trash your clutch so its no win situation there. Really, put your auto in neutral and brake to zero then put it in gear and try braking again applying the brake pedal the same amount and you will carry substantially farther down the road.
Except that doesn't hold up either.

My ALH Jetta has tended to go through rear brakes at roughly double the rate of front's -- they apparently all do. ~40k miles for rears, about ~80k miles for fronts. It's a stick.

It's also got almost 200,000 miles on it and is still on the factory clutch.... so much for that theory....
 
#33 ·
The funny thing with the ALH is that what forced the change on the fronts from stock wasn't pad wear-out -- one of the sliders stuck on the passenger side caliper which I saw on a tire rotation. I still had ~25% left on the driver side pads -- the wear indicator light was nowhere near coming on. I suspect I would have easily made 100k miles if that hadn't happened and might have made 125.
 
#35 ·
To those with warped brakes, do you notice your steering wheel vibrating, or more so the seats?

With my 6, i can definetly feel the rear pads over heating easily, from just a couple mild to harder stops with the flow of traffic on the highway.
 
#37 ·
All I want to say is F these damn rotors. I will be going in for my 25K service and I need them to address the issue. Vibrating pedal and steering wheel I don't like. The 1st time I had to do this was around the 15K mark so obviously these things suck. Had the same issue later on down the road in my 2004 Mazda 6 so it's Mazda supplier.

Who knows how to bed rotors properly so I can get rid of this problem forever?
 
#38 ·
Ah..to hell with the 2yr brake fluid change regimen (I'm over a year; brake fluid reservoir color now darker/opaque; noticeable brake fade).

I'm DIY changing the stock Mazda DOT3 to ATE Super Blue Racing DOT4.

http://forum.mazda6club.com/mazda-6...super-blue-racing-dot4-flush.html#post4021873

http://forum.mazda6club.com/mazda-6...z-many-you-were-looking-them.html#post4056594

Plus I just ordered parts to convert my 0100 European Motive Bleeder above, for Japanese retrofit duty ($75 shipped):

Motive 0400 Brass Adapter Kit
Motive 1107 Ford/Asian Adapter
Motive Bleeder Catch Bottles (2)
ATE Super Gold Type 200 (identical specs/supercedes ATE Super Blue Racing, backup)
 
#39 ·
so far no brake issues with me after 11K miles 1 year and a month, and this includes a handful of panic stops from 60 and a few moderate canyon runs. On my parents 1st gen CRV it has over 200K and i beleive its still on the stock front rotors, and they still got plenty of meat.
 
#40 ·
Thank goodness for MT. I just did probably the most abrupt, emergency maneuver (upon ownership of this car) this morning (a sudden, complete full stop of traffic, all1-4 lanes on elevated curved part of 710/5 interchange courtesy of idiot Caltrans, with no forward early warning) while I was on #1 lane doing 65-ish...and I only have as I estimate 100ft or so. Luckily, the # 2 lane has more braking distance room. I slammed the brakes in a flashing/pumping mode to warn the car behind me and with full engine braking from the 6th gear and down so fast...My alertness/split second decision must've saved me from slamming into someone's rear on #1 so hard. I cannot imagine doing that abrupt full stop, in a 6AT.

I am now more determined than ever, to alleviate that noticeable brake fade (as the stock Mazda DOT3 brake fluid gets older, now a tinge darker than bright new, level a tad below "max").Though I have none to report of any shimmy, pulsing brake pedal nor traversing that shaking to the steering wheel.
 
#41 · (Edited)
Thank goodness for MT. I just did probably the most abrupt, emergency maneuver (upon ownership of this car) this morning (a sudden, complete full stop of traffic, all1-4 lanes on elevated curved part of 710/5 interchange courtesy of idiot Caltrans, with no forward early warning) while I was on #1 lane doing 70-ish...and I only have as I estimate 100ft or so. Luckily, the # 2 lane has more braking distance room. I slammed the brakes in a flashing/pumping mode to warn the car behind me and with full engine braking from the 6th gear and down so fast...My alertness/split second decision must've saved me from slamming into someone's rear on #1 so hard. I cannot imagine doing that abrupt full stop, in a 6AT.

I am now more determined than ever, to alleviate that noticeable brake fade (as the stock Mazda DOT3 brake fluid gets older, now a tinge darker than bright new, level a tad below "max").Though I have none to report of any shimmy, pulsing brake pedal nor traversing that shaking to the steering wheel. 1Yr/2 wks of ownership, 10,706mi on the clock.
 
#42 ·
Thank goodness for MT. I just did probably the most abrupt, emergency maneuver (upon ownership of this car) this morning (a sudden, complete full stop of traffic, all1-4 lanes on elevated curved part of 710/5 interchange courtesy of idiot Caltrans, with no forward early warning) while I was on #1 lane doing 70-ish...and I only have as I estimate 100ft or so. Luckily, the # 2 lane has more braking distance room. I slammed the brakes in a flashing/pumping mode to warn the car behind me and with full engine braking from the 6th gear and down so fast...My alertness/split second decision must've saved me from slamming into someone's rear on #1 so hard. I cannot imagine doing that abrupt full stop, in a 6AT.

I am now more determined than ever, to alleviate that noticeable brake fade (as the stock Mazda DOT3 brake fluid gets older, now a tinge darker than bright new, level a tad below "max").Though I have none to report of any shimmy, pulsing brake pedal nor traversing that shaking to the steering wheel.

I wouldn't venture to underestimate the AT's braking capability too much, it can rev match and make downshifts very very quickly. Easier for the GT guys with paddles, but still doable for the other cars in MT mode when needed. I do it often in the miata (paddles) and occasionally in the 6. It's a carry-over habit from daily driving a manual for the last 6 years straight LOL.

Looking forward to the report back on braking changes after the fluid swap Ex!! No problems here still with shimmying and such. Brake fade hasn't been noticeable either aside from the loss of tire grip at the limit with wear/age.
 
#52 ·
So what you're saying is, you don't want to jinx yourself after that? lol.

Also happily noting that emergency braking the 6 holds up well with a proper (read: alert and ready to act with an escape route) driver LOL.
 
#53 ·
Jinx? Wut jinx, RT..I'm at work right now tending to my patients...I have to load the sd card from my Blackvue to my desktop. Can't wait to see it, huh...

Boy you do sure have a lot of time in your hands..:lol:
 
#61 ·
What, is it not fun for you when someone is pointing out a mistake of your own? One that you can't refute with your years beyond my own time of driving a manual transmission car? Or one that can't be taken up with your glorious past of all those diesel powered cars and prior VW? :D For a person to gripe about how much I bring up my other vehicles (and you must've taken quite a liking to my formula as well, as honestly looking back through my posts, I reference several of my past cars in comparisons, but that's the only one you banter about. Envy perhaps?) you sure do bring up your ex cars quite a lot :).

Have a great day yourself, I'll even make some popcorn on your behalf when I get home.... or is that the sound of the cam churning exhaust gasses around? ah well.





Now, can we get back to the issues of heat material build up on the rotors of these cars to get something productive going again? :D
 
#63 ·
This thread has me thinking. I think I'm going to look into drilled rotors for my next set of rotors, since their main function is weight reduction. Any loss of heat sink ability that increases temps can be overcome by using ATE super blue racing brake fluid I would think.

Less rotational weight and better brake fade resistance, sounds like a win-win.
 
#64 ·
To some degree... The fluid will be able to withstand higher temps without boiling and failing. That alone won't help cool the brakes any faster, but will keep the line pressure up and air bubbles out helping the pistons hammer the pads onto the caliper better during extreme circumstances :D. The limiting factor would be the OEM brake pads glazing over instead of the fluid boiling now.

Less rotating weight, win x2, rotating weight counts double after all :D !! There was a really tech heavy thread about brakes here recently with some great articles detailing the issues of drilled rotors, IIRC with modern brakes, it doesn't make a big difference in braking ability, and typically cost braking ability. So, let's split the difference and call it win, win, lose? lol
 
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