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post #11 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-26-2018, 09:18 PM
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Take a look at the escalation in CAFE requirements for small vehicles and tell me how you meet them.

Ford is simply doing what everyone else is going to do. You're going to lose the choice to have a fuel-burning vehicle within the next 10 years because the CAFE is 60Mpg fleet-wide by then for a small car, and 46 for a larger vehicle (e.g. a Mazda "6".)

TRUCKS aren't a LOT better, until you get to the larger trucks. Then it's 30, with a real EPA window sticker of 23 -- which the current F150 with the new diesel can hit NOW.

Kill all the carbon weenies right NOW or lose the ability to buy a vehicle that doesn't have to be plugged in and can only travel 150 miles without requiring a 3+ hour charge. Oh, and they still haven't (and won't) solve the physics problem with the battery packs either, so welcome to $20,000+ batteries; this makes a sub-30k car basically impossible to build.

The only other answer will be something like the Elio, and only because it's legally a motorcycle and thus doesn't have to carry around 500lbs of garbage that the government mandates every "car" must have, and which impacts fuel burn tremendously.
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post #12 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-27-2018, 09:38 AM
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The current gen Fiesta and Focus especially in ST trims are fantastic cars ! They are great value for money but somehow we in this country refuse to outgrow our love for CUVs and SUVs. Ford teased us with european spec Focus and Fiesta for few years and are now snatching them away from us ! As for the Fusion, it was and still is the third best selling car in the states, and it baffles my mind why Ford would want to kill it. As of last evening, Ford has confirmed production end dates for Fiesta and Focus will be May/June 2018, but Fusion remains open-ended until they revisit the decision in 2020.

This decision wont remain confined within Ford, other manufacturers especially those who are strapped for cash or are burning cash like Mazda and Hyundai/KIA will take a closer look at the outcome of this decision. With the current Mazda6 already into its 6th year with just minor cosmetic revisions, i wonder if Mazda will decide to completely kill it off to make space for a new CX7. Interesting times ahead....
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post #13 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-27-2018, 10:58 AM
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I stand firm on the concept that the internal combustion engine is going bye bye very soon and they have just not let it slip in any official way. Seeing that the EU has publicly stated a date of demise it would be wise for North America to understand that we alone do not dictate the global market and as such we are not going to be able to demand anything from manufacturers.

I would not be surprised to see small engines (well under 1L) used as range extenders but they will only generate electricity, not propulsion. This way, manufacturers can easily meet MPG ratings while giving us some sort of usable range. Trucks and larger vehicles will remain internal combustion for a while longer, but that will only last until we get some sort of advanced battery technology.

Without starting a political debate over climate change, we are being pushed out of the combustion engine by imperfect science and I also think that the manufacturers see more profit in electrics and the prospect that once there is an official ban on petrol engines there will be an initial huge demand for new electrics. It's like they all said in a private closed boardroom "If we all do it at once we will all make lots of dough".

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post #14 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-27-2018, 11:43 AM Thread Starter
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I agree that the world is too enamored with vehicle electrification. That electricity comes from somewhere, and those sources aren't much cleaner than internal combustion when you take everything into account. Large wind and solar farms are a major hazard to birds. Solar panels produce a very toxic bi-product in the manufacturing process. Both forms only have 20% efficiency in the best conditions with the current technology. Hydroelectric plants tear up an ecosystem to put the reservoirs in place.

The other question that still has not been answered is: What about people who don't have access to 'at home' charging stations? Tesla is starting to crack down on 'moochers' who do 100% of their recharging at their supercharger stations. I still don't see multi-family units being proactive in building charging stations into their complexes. What will those who cannot either afford or get access to electrification do when it's their only choice?

Mazda, Hyundai and Toyota are proving that internal combustion can be much more efficient (HCCI, fuel cell, etc) but when these eco-terrorists get their mind set on an idea, they try to force the rest of the world into their line of thinking.
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post #15 of 22 (permalink) Old 04-27-2018, 02:04 PM
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Whether we like it or now, electric and self driving cars are the future. Volvo has already said 2020 will be the final year for their pure IC engines and everything after that will have electric motor either being primary or as supplemental.

Mazda is already working with Toyota to get hybrid technology, and pretty much everyone in the industry is gearing up towards automation and electrification. I've said this many a times, we are perhaps in the last golden era for internal combustion powered automobiles. Never in my life time do i remember having so many great choices across manufacturers in every segment. 20 years from now we'll probably only see little self driving electric CUVs and SUVs.
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post #16 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-01-2018, 07:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MilR View Post
Whether we like it or now, electric and self driving cars are the future. Volvo has already said 2020 will be the final year for their pure IC engines and everything after that will have electric motor either being primary or as supplemental.

Mazda is already working with Toyota to get hybrid technology, and pretty much everyone in the industry is gearing up towards automation and electrification. I've said this many a times, we are perhaps in the last golden era for internal combustion powered automobiles. Never in my life time do i remember having so many great choices across manufacturers in every segment. 20 years from now we'll probably only see little self driving electric CUVs and SUVs.
Its gonna be a pretty grim future.

I guess by the time your grandkids' grandkids are adults, nobody will remember how to drive a car. Then nobody will care.


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post #17 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-01-2018, 03:13 PM
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post #18 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-01-2018, 08:40 PM
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I have already told my 15yr old he will very likely see the end of self driving cars, but I also believe we are 50-75yrs from that. Time will tell.

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post #19 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-03-2018, 08:36 AM
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I have now noticed that FOrd is only advertising on TV for their SUV lineup. I would think the coming regulations don't touch SUV's yet and seeing how well they are selling this segment will likely stay petrol powered for some time. Diesel power, other than commercial and industrial, is toast though.

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post #20 of 22 (permalink) Old 05-03-2018, 10:09 AM
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I taught my 17 year old how to drive a stick two years ago. I'm hoping he'll teach his kids the same some day, even if there won't be very many traditional manual transmission cars around by then.
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