Sound Deadening - Door Panels - Mazda 6 Forums : Mazda 6 / Mazda Atenza Forum

WRW-Sydney · 05-01-2005, 03:27 AM

Hi Guys,

We have all owned our Mazda 6's for a while now, but this is still good imformation for new car owners as well.

Some of us have started upgrading the standard audio system (those of us without the 220 watt Bose System), and this has involved replacing the very average standard speakers and using a (350 watt plus amplifier) to improve the quality of the sound.

A set of new good quality speakers can be had for $300.00 for 4 speakers and a good quality amplifer for another $300.00. A cheap investment for a large improvement.

What you choose in these products is your own choice, but I crrently have installed:

4 x JBL GTO 8626 ... Two-Way Speakers
1 x Alpine MRP-F240 ... 4 Channel Amplifier (under the front passenger seat)

.................................................. ..................................................

But with the improvement in sound through better speakers and more power to run them, comes a problem found in every car. The outer skins on the care doors, will vibrate with the increased bass from the speakers.

If you have a look at teh car door skin internally, you'll find they aren't secured in the centre, so act like a large "Drum Skin" when sound waves hit them.

There is however two ways to reduce or stop this door skin drumming.

METHOD 1:
This is the cheapest option and will only REDUCE the drumming.
Accross the centre of the internal car door is a "side intusion bar" which is aimed to provide some additional strength and security to the door, in case of a side-on collision.

This bar isn't tubular, but more box section with splade ends where it attaches.

However this side intrusion bar does come within 0.5 - 1.0 mm of the door out skin. By purchasing and using a tube of silicone adhesive, to adhere the side intrusion bar to the door skin, you provide a form of rigidity to the door skin and reduce drumming.

A 5mm to 10mm tubular shaped line of this silicone adhesive (it is flexible when dry) along the full-length top and bottom of the side intrusion beam, does the job. Obviously you have to make sure the adhesive, contacts both the door skin and the side intrusion bar.

Buying the silicone adhesive in small 30ml tubes is an aboslute wasyte of time. It's best to buy a tradesman size large rigid plastic tube and use this in a metal racket gun, which we have all seen before. This method is far cheaper and 100 times quicker to apply.

.................................................. .................................................. ............

METHOD 2:

This method involves using method 1 as a basic improvement and then going one major step beyond.

After you've done Method 1 you can actual feel how "less tinny" your car door feels when compared to a door that hasn't been done ... just use the knuckes on the back of your hand again the car door outer skin.

Method 2 is designed to virtually eliminate this out door skin flexing completely.

This involves coating the "inside" of your outer door skin with a special matting of 2mm bituman attached to a 0.5mm coating of special flexible aluminum sheet. These sheets come pre-made in 330mm x 330mm sheets, 2 per pack.

Each pack is expensive at around $25.00 (includes 2 sheets). Cheaper when bought in packs of 5 or even cheaper in packs of 10.

Now the pack will say " 1 pack will cover one standard door" but this is a joke guys. I have done both front doors now, and each required 7 sheets of the special matting (or 3.5 packs per door) to do the job 100% correctly ... you know what I'm like.

See below for pictures of these special mats and installation.

PHOTO LINK:
http://au.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/mp3smith2...h2005/my_photos

PHOTO LINK INSULATION MATERIAL:
http://au.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/mp3smith2...lbum?.dir=/5404

.................................................. .................................................. ...............

Well Guys ..... it's a basic process that anyone could do, it just takes time and a little patience ... sorry no short-cuts if you want the best results.

The Door trim is removed 1st, followed by the removal in the door inner panel (black rigid plastic fibre). Once these have been taken off, the entire inner door skin is easily accessable.

It's just a case of removing the protecive skin off of the special matting and pushing it against the inside door skill. The adhesive properties of the bituman, holds it against the door skin (forever). Obviously there is a lot of "cutting and pasting" using normal household scissors, to cut sections of the mat to fill all gaps (do the cutting of the mat pior to remoal of the protective plastic film). Kersosene or turps will allow you to clean up the scissors and your hands later.

The most important part of this story ... the results. An absolutely HUGE improve in panel flexing and HUGE improvement in general sound deadening, even if you don't upgrade your audio.

I intend to do the rear doors shortly (being smaller, probably only 3 packs per door will be required). If your wanted to go further you could do your rear seat parcel shelf and even the boot floor ...

Have a look at the "HOW TO SECTION" to see removal of the car door trim.

Warren

BeeF · 05-01-2005, 08:49 PM

Thanks for the write up Warren. Around $50 per door isn't too bad. I assume you are using the stuff you get from Jaycar.

One question though, did you clean the inside of the door skin with metho (or some other cleaner) or were mats sticky enough not to worry about this?

TheJabba · 05-02-2005, 12:21 AM

Hi folks,

Just to let you know , there is also a brush on alternative that was $50.00 for a 1 litre tub...

http://www.darkscience.com.au/

I purchased my tub from Jerg at Auto Acoustics before they had the fire in Alexandria...

And the tub was enough for both doors in my 92 civic hatch...

Recommended.

MrPayner · 05-02-2005, 04:05 AM

Hi Warren..

Great write up! How does the Alpine AMP sound with the JBL's? I have just purchased this amp myself [a few weeks ago now] and I"m just waiting until i have some spare time to install it myself. I have the GTO636E 3 way 6" drivers in all doors, and i'm hoping that it's going to shake my little space boots..

Cheers
Adam

WRW-Sydney · 05-03-2005, 10:25 AM

Hi Guys,

Funny you should mention the Sound Deadening Liquid.... I just put it through the entire boot of the car last weekend ... has quieten things down a fair amount. A lot of removing trims and masking area's to keep it looking professional.

I'm quiet happy with the doors using the mats and will use that in the rear doors as well ... and in regards to the question on surface preparation, I just wiped the inner doors skins down with "White Spirits" first. The bituman backing would stick to anything, so surface preparation isn't as critical.

I have also jacked my Mazda 6 up on stands and and down the entire underbody (underneath the car) with a liquid bituman based deadening product from HR. As well as preventing corrosion, it ha sfurther quietened down the car and only $30.00 for a 1 litre tin ... just brush it on, two coats required.

Good choice of amplifier, Jabba helped me decide on this unit as well. You obviously know what your doing with the install, but feel free to ask questions about an install in the Mazda 6. I have a "HOW TO" article written on this installation, with pictures.

Great to catch up and chat with everyone again .... Warren

TheJabba · 05-04-2005, 12:09 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by WRW-Sydney@May 3 2005, 02:25 PM
Hi Guys,

Funny you should mention the Sound Deadening Liquid.... I just put it through the entire boot of the car last weekend ... has quieten things down a fair amount. A lot of removing trims and masking area's to keep it looking professional.

I'm quiet happy with the doors using the mats and will use that in the rear doors as well ... and in regards to the question on surface preparation, I just wiped the inner doors skins down with "White Spirits" first. The bituman backing would stick to anything, so surface preparation isn't as critical.

I have also jacked my Mazda 6 up on stands and and down the entire underbody (underneath the car) with a liquid bituman based deadening product from HR. As well as preventing corrosion, it ha sfurther quietened down the car and only $30.00 for a 1 litre tin ... just brush it on, two coats required.

Good choice of amplifier, Jabba helped me decide on this unit as well. You obviously know what your doing with the install, but feel free to ask questions about an install in the Mazda 6. I have a "HOW TO" article written on this installation, with pictures.

Great to catch up and chat with everyone again .... Warren

[snapback]403618[/snapback]

Actually the other thing you can do as well, is to stick a layer of speaker carpeting over the top of the paint-on sound deading... just be sure to get a colour that matches the rest of the boot. Jaycar sell the carpet as well as the spray on adhesive although I'm not sure about the range of colours they have available. Just remember to have it fairly taut when sticking down otherwise you'll get ridges and creases.

And also don't forget to put an inline fuse for you amp in no further than 30cm from the positive terminal of the battery...

BeeF · 05-04-2005, 07:10 AM

If I had a tip on the speaker carpeting get it from a fabric store, it is way cheaper per metre.

LivewireDiR · 05-24-2005, 05:46 PM

Hey guys. Just thought I would say I am gonna post a full write up on the system I have in our demo vehicle when I get a second.

We have sound deadened all 4 doors and quarters (wagon) with tar matting from Fusion. This stuff is about $17/ sheet and is enough to do a door per sheet. It has dramatically reduced road noise and resonance. Highly recommended.

I'll post pic's and spec when I get a chance.

cya

rambo2300 · 05-24-2005, 10:15 PM

What other speakers are much better compared to stock?

BeeF · 05-25-2005, 01:06 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by rambo2300@May 25 2005, 12:15 PM
What other speakers are much better compared to stock?

[snapback]417661[/snapback]

Depends on your taste. Sound is subjective...you would need to listen with your own ears.

Personally I can't really tell too much of a difference between an $200 and an $800 speaker so why pay more

Some people say they can hear a $600 difference and happily pay the extra.

I would say anything with a seperate tweeter rather than the dual cones that are in the Aus spec car as standard are likely to be an improvement.

I assume you live in the US so you guys already get a tweeters mounted in the front A pillars yes?

05-02-2005, 12:21 AM	#3 (permalink)
TheJabba Rally Racer Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 1,010 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader: 0 reviews	Hi folks, Just to let you know , there is also a brush on alternative that was $50.00 for a 1 litre tub... http://www.darkscience.com.au/ I purchased my tub from Jerg at Auto Acoustics before they had the fire in Alexandria... And the tub was enough for both doors in my 92 civic hatch... Recommended. __________________ Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level then beat you with experience. My opinions may have changed, but not the fact that I am right. Nothing is fool proof, fools are too inventive.

05-02-2005, 04:05 AM	#4 (permalink)
MrPayner Track Racer Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Victoria, Australia Posts: 233 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader: 0 reviews	Hi Warren.. Great write up! How does the Alpine AMP sound with the JBL's? I have just purchased this amp myself [a few weeks ago now] and I"m just waiting until i have some spare time to install it myself. I have the GTO636E 3 way 6" drivers in all doors, and i'm hoping that it's going to shake my little space boots.. Cheers Adam __________________ 2004 Mazda6 Luxury Sport 5spd Manual, her name is Yvaine AstinaGT.com Forum Administrator

05-24-2005, 10:15 PM	#9 (permalink)
rambo2300 Track Racer Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Hotlanta Posts: 258 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader: 0 reviews	What other speakers are much better compared to stock? __________________ [COLOR=yellow]Mazda 6i white

05-01-2005, 03:27 AM	#1 (permalink)
WRW-Sydney Track Racer Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 458 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader: 0 reviews	Hi Guys, We have all owned our Mazda 6's for a while now, but this is still good imformation for new car owners as well. Some of us have started upgrading the standard audio system (those of us without the 220 watt Bose System), and this has involved replacing the very average standard speakers and using a (350 watt plus amplifier) to improve the quality of the sound. A set of new good quality speakers can be had for $300.00 for 4 speakers and a good quality amplifer for another $300.00. A cheap investment for a large improvement. What you choose in these products is your own choice, but I crrently have installed: 4 x JBL GTO 8626 ... Two-Way Speakers 1 x Alpine MRP-F240 ... 4 Channel Amplifier (under the front passenger seat) .................................................. .................................................. But with the improvement in sound through better speakers and more power to run them, comes a problem found in every car. The outer skins on the care doors, will vibrate with the increased bass from the speakers. If you have a look at teh car door skin internally, you'll find they aren't secured in the centre, so act like a large "Drum Skin" when sound waves hit them. There is however two ways to reduce or stop this door skin drumming. METHOD 1: This is the cheapest option and will only REDUCE the drumming. Accross the centre of the internal car door is a "side intusion bar" which is aimed to provide some additional strength and security to the door, in case of a side-on collision. This bar isn't tubular, but more box section with splade ends where it attaches. However this side intrusion bar does come within 0.5 - 1.0 mm of the door out skin. By purchasing and using a tube of silicone adhesive, to adhere the side intrusion bar to the door skin, you provide a form of rigidity to the door skin and reduce drumming. A 5mm to 10mm tubular shaped line of this silicone adhesive (it is flexible when dry) along the full-length top and bottom of the side intrusion beam, does the job. Obviously you have to make sure the adhesive, contacts both the door skin and the side intrusion bar. Buying the silicone adhesive in small 30ml tubes is an aboslute wasyte of time. It's best to buy a tradesman size large rigid plastic tube and use this in a metal racket gun, which we have all seen before. This method is far cheaper and 100 times quicker to apply. .................................................. .................................................. ............ METHOD 2: This method involves using method 1 as a basic improvement and then going one major step beyond. After you've done Method 1 you can actual feel how "less tinny" your car door feels when compared to a door that hasn't been done ... just use the knuckes on the back of your hand again the car door outer skin. Method 2 is designed to virtually eliminate this out door skin flexing completely. This involves coating the "inside" of your outer door skin with a special matting of 2mm bituman attached to a 0.5mm coating of special flexible aluminum sheet. These sheets come pre-made in 330mm x 330mm sheets, 2 per pack. Each pack is expensive at around $25.00 (includes 2 sheets). Cheaper when bought in packs of 5 or even cheaper in packs of 10. Now the pack will say " 1 pack will cover one standard door" but this is a joke guys. I have done both front doors now, and each required 7 sheets of the special matting (or 3.5 packs per door) to do the job 100% correctly ... you know what I'm like. See below for pictures of these special mats and installation. PHOTO LINK: http://au.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/mp3smith2...h2005/my_photos PHOTO LINK INSULATION MATERIAL: http://au.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/mp3smith2...lbum?.dir=/5404 .................................................. .................................................. ............... Well Guys ..... it's a basic process that anyone could do, it just takes time and a little patience ... sorry no short-cuts if you want the best results. The Door trim is removed 1st, followed by the removal in the door inner panel (black rigid plastic fibre). Once these have been taken off, the entire inner door skin is easily accessable. It's just a case of removing the protecive skin off of the special matting and pushing it against the inside door skill. The adhesive properties of the bituman, holds it against the door skin (forever). Obviously there is a lot of "cutting and pasting" using normal household scissors, to cut sections of the mat to fill all gaps (do the cutting of the mat pior to remoal of the protective plastic film). Kersosene or turps will allow you to clean up the scissors and your hands later. The most important part of this story ... the results. An absolutely HUGE improve in panel flexing and HUGE improvement in general sound deadening, even if you don't upgrade your audio. I intend to do the rear doors shortly (being smaller, probably only 3 packs per door will be required). If your wanted to go further you could do your rear seat parcel shelf and even the boot floor ... Have a look at the "HOW TO SECTION" to see removal of the car door trim. Warren

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05-01-2005, 08:49 PM	#2 (permalink)
BeeF Track Racer Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Adelaide, Australia Posts: 607 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader: 0 reviews	Thanks for the write up Warren. Around $50 per door isn't too bad. I assume you are using the stuff you get from Jaycar. One question though, did you clean the inside of the door skin with metho (or some other cleaner) or were mats sticky enough not to worry about this?

05-03-2005, 10:25 AM	#5 (permalink)
WRW-Sydney Track Racer Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 458 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader: 0 reviews	Hi Guys, Funny you should mention the Sound Deadening Liquid.... I just put it through the entire boot of the car last weekend ... has quieten things down a fair amount. A lot of removing trims and masking area's to keep it looking professional. I'm quiet happy with the doors using the mats and will use that in the rear doors as well ... and in regards to the question on surface preparation, I just wiped the inner doors skins down with "White Spirits" first. The bituman backing would stick to anything, so surface preparation isn't as critical. I have also jacked my Mazda 6 up on stands and and down the entire underbody (underneath the car) with a liquid bituman based deadening product from HR. As well as preventing corrosion, it ha sfurther quietened down the car and only $30.00 for a 1 litre tin ... just brush it on, two coats required. Good choice of amplifier, Jabba helped me decide on this unit as well. You obviously know what your doing with the install, but feel free to ask questions about an install in the Mazda 6. I have a "HOW TO" article written on this installation, with pictures. Great to catch up and chat with everyone again .... Warren

05-04-2005, 07:10 AM	#7 (permalink)
BeeF Track Racer Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Adelaide, Australia Posts: 607 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader: 0 reviews	If I had a tip on the speaker carpeting get it from a fabric store, it is way cheaper per metre.

05-24-2005, 05:46 PM	#8 (permalink)
LivewireDiR Learners License Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 24 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader: 0 reviews	Hey guys. Just thought I would say I am gonna post a full write up on the system I have in our demo vehicle when I get a second. We have sound deadened all 4 doors and quarters (wagon) with tar matting from Fusion. This stuff is about $17/ sheet and is enough to do a door per sheet. It has dramatically reduced road noise and resonance. Highly recommended. I'll post pic's and spec when I get a chance. cya