Put this in laymens terms for me please - Mazda 6 Forums : Mazda 6 Forum / Mazda Atenza Forum
User Tag List

 2Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-18-2017, 05:46 PM Thread Starter
Learners License
 
Myfirstmazda6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Arkansas, USA
Posts: 16
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Thanks: 6
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Groans: 0
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Garage
iTrader: 0 reviews
Arrow Put this in laymens terms for me please

First off, please forgive my ignorance in some areas. This is my first DIY home fix and I know I am on a steep learning curve. I bought my first 2004 M6s 3.0 yesterday and it has a check engine light on. Long story short e-bay buy that I will never do again.

I had it coded today and these were the codes. (it was coded at autozone)

P0300 - Random Misfire Detected
P2112 - TP Sensor minimum stop range/performance problem
P2100 - Throttle Actuator circuit open
P2110 - Throttle valve actuator control system-forced limited RPM
P0431 - Catalyst System (LH) efficiency below threshold.

What does this mean? What could be the issue? What am I leaving out that you need to know?

you can get a little further in-depth story on my newbie into post - Newbie to it all and proud of it. We all have to start somewhere.
edks likes this.
Myfirstmazda6 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-18-2017, 06:42 PM
Registered User
 
toy4x's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: So Cal
Posts: 486
Mentioned: 11 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 110 Post(s)
Thanks: 12
Thanked 41 Times in 38 Posts
Groans: 1
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Garage
iTrader: 0 reviews
Send a message via Yahoo to toy4x
P0300- could be a coil/Spark plug/ vacuum / or EGR valve.

P2110/2100/2112- all point to a bad throttle body.

P0431- bad front 02 sensor or the cat is clogged.

Good luck!

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

2016 Mazda 6 GT Reflex Blue Mica
Black Chrome 19" Stock Wheels
Formula 1 Pinnacle Ceramic Tint 30% * Air Blue 80 Windshield Tint
OEM Splash Guards
AIO Tweaks
Tanabe Medalion Exhaust & NF210 Lowering Springs
Koni FSD Shocks / Struts
toy4x is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to toy4x For This Useful Post:
Myfirstmazda6 (03-19-2017)
post #3 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-18-2017, 08:48 PM
Registered User
 
DrFeelGood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 166
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 27 Post(s)
Thanks: 32
Thanked 21 Times in 18 Posts
Groans: 0
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Garage
iTrader: 0 reviews
If I had to make a guess I would say bad Ignition coils for the P0300. They rarely need replacing in most other cars but in this Ford engine they are notorious. I have had a set that tested okay but were clearly bad when in service.

The misfire (P0300) will cause increased un-burnt fuel to enter the catalytic converters and cause them to overheat (sulfur smell). This smell from time to time is normal with harder acceleration but after a while will cause the converter to overheat and melt. this sends pieces downstream into the second catalyst, helping to clog it. This model also has a bad reputation for rarely pulling some of those catalyst pieces back into the EGR and causing dramatically increases oil consumption that leads to engine failure.

The P0431 (or P0421 for the other converter) means that the computer is comparing both the upstream O2 sensor reading (before the manifold catalyst also called TWC - three-way catalyst) and the downstream O2 reading to see if the TWC is working properly.

Normal upstream oxygen sensors should be moving failry rapidly from near zero to near one. Something like 0.08 to 0.9 as a range. Up and down up and down maybe once or twice a second. Like a sine wave.

Normal downstream Oxygen sensors should be fairly stable and close to flat line. If the downstream sensor is moving like the upstream sensor (like a shadow) then the computer assumes the catalyst is no longer working and reports a code. Average service like for a 4-wire O2 sensor (like ours) is 100,000mi (according to NTK)

I just did this again. You can read about it here

I suppose in layman's terms: it means work.

2004 Wagon S 3.0, 5-speed ATX, Performance White (A2N) 167,000mi

Last edited by DrFeelGood; 03-18-2017 at 08:50 PM.
DrFeelGood is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to DrFeelGood For This Useful Post:
Myfirstmazda6 (03-19-2017)
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-19-2017, 08:27 AM Thread Starter
Learners License
 
Myfirstmazda6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Arkansas, USA
Posts: 16
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Thanks: 6
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Groans: 0
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Garage
iTrader: 0 reviews
It will make for a good weekend project. I went and bought 6 new coil pack replacements and plugs. Looking for a throttle body today. I'll give you guys an update in a few days. Thanks for your help.
Myfirstmazda6 is offline  
post #5 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-19-2017, 11:35 AM
Registered User
 
DrFeelGood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 166
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 27 Post(s)
Thanks: 32
Thanked 21 Times in 18 Posts
Groans: 0
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Garage
iTrader: 0 reviews
Terrific. Once the misfire is remedied you can look to replacing the exhaust components. I would recommend pulling out the camshaft position sensors (CMP) and the crank position sensor (CKP) and wipe them off. Over time and mileage they build a fine layer of metal on them that can affect the ignition. One bolt each and they slide right out. A cloth wipes off all the metal dust stuck to the magnet. Mine was noticeably smoother after doing the service.

2004 Wagon S 3.0, 5-speed ATX, Performance White (A2N) 167,000mi
DrFeelGood is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to DrFeelGood For This Useful Post:
Neanderthal (03-21-2017)
post #6 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-19-2017, 12:08 PM
Registered User
 
jman1200's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Ontario/Canada
Posts: 167
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 22 Post(s)
Thanks: 3
Thanked 21 Times in 19 Posts
Groans: 0
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Garage
iTrader: 0 reviews
I'd replace the sparks and coils before buying any other parts. Reset the codes and see what shows up after that repair.

2016-Current: 2006 Mazda 6 GT - V6 - Hatchback w/NAV

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

2008-2015: 2004 Mazda 6 GS - I4

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
jman1200 is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to jman1200 For This Useful Post:
Myfirstmazda6 (03-19-2017)
post #7 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-19-2017, 01:17 PM Thread Starter
Learners License
 
Myfirstmazda6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Arkansas, USA
Posts: 16
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Thanks: 6
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Groans: 0
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Garage
iTrader: 0 reviews
Based on what I have read and the input you guys have given me. This is the plan.

To handle the P0300 code, I will replace all 6 spark plugs and all 6 Coil packs. (something I had planned on as I just bought this car 3 days ago.) That should take care of that problem if that is even the cause of it.

Since I have it broken down that far, I'm going to go ahead and replace the PCV valve since the car has 174,000 miles on it and I don't know the history. I'm already going to be working in the area so might as well knock that out.

P2112, P2100, and P2110, Looks like I will end up replacing the TB. Not much else I have seen has been the problem with these codes.

P0431 could be a number of issues. more than likely with this year model, it's going to be the cat but I will check the O2 sensors first because I don't have any "strange" smells happening.

I bought this car 3 days ago not knowing anything about these problems. (got it on e-bay sight unseen. foolish me trusted the buyer and their feedback) If I were to resale it now I would be out a bit of money. If I pay to fix it all, I will be out a bit of money and time. I must have a case of Stockholm Syndrome for this car. Somehow it has convinced me to look at it like I'm adopting an injured animal that needs me to nurse it back to health.

Question. How likely is it that I destroy my engine by driving with bad cats for a while? I don't think I will have the funds to fix it right away after the purchase of TB and coils but I need the vehicle sooner rather than later waiting on a catalytic converter fix. I know that if I have to replace it, I might as well replace the whole system all at once. It would be nice to have an exhaust system with a deeper sound to it anyway.
Myfirstmazda6 is offline  
post #8 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-19-2017, 03:52 PM
Registered User
 
toy4x's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: So Cal
Posts: 486
Mentioned: 11 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 110 Post(s)
Thanks: 12
Thanked 41 Times in 38 Posts
Groans: 1
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Garage
iTrader: 0 reviews
Send a message via Yahoo to toy4x
#1 cause of engine failure on the 1st gen V6 is clogged cats. So running around with a code already coming up is probably not the best idea.

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

2016 Mazda 6 GT Reflex Blue Mica
Black Chrome 19" Stock Wheels
Formula 1 Pinnacle Ceramic Tint 30% * Air Blue 80 Windshield Tint
OEM Splash Guards
AIO Tweaks
Tanabe Medalion Exhaust & NF210 Lowering Springs
Koni FSD Shocks / Struts
toy4x is offline  
post #9 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-19-2017, 04:08 PM
Registered User
 
DrFeelGood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 166
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 27 Post(s)
Thanks: 32
Thanked 21 Times in 18 Posts
Groans: 0
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Garage
iTrader: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by Myfirstmazda6 View Post
To handle the P0300 code, I will replace all 6 spark plugs and all 6 Coil packs. (something I had planned on as I just bought this car 3 days ago.) That should take care of that problem if that is even the cause of it.
Agreed

Quote:
Originally Posted by Myfirstmazda6 View Post
Since I have it broken down that far, I'm going to go ahead and replace the PCV valve since the car has 174,000 miles on it and I don't know the history. I'm already going to be working in the area so might as well knock that out.
Make sure you check the new valve before you install it. I just purchased one that allowed me to blow air in both directions. This is not ideal. As a result I still have the old one in that I check every oil change.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Myfirstmazda6 View Post
P0431 could be a number of issues. more than likely with this year model, it's going to be the cat but I will check the O2 sensors first because I don't have any "strange" smells happening.
At this point I would not imagine you would smell any sulfur smells and the catalyst is likely destroyed (assumption here). You could crawl under the car and shake the flex pipe to hear if there is anything loose inside.
This is what mine looked like when I took it off


If the catalyst has started to disintegrate people have reported a possibility of pulling this material back in through the EGR
Whats your oil consumption like? granted its new to you so you likely don't know the full story there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Myfirstmazda6 View Post
Question. How likely is it that I destroy my engine by driving with bad cats for a while? I don't think I will have the funds to fix it right away after the purchase of TB and coils but I need the vehicle sooner rather than later waiting on a catalytic converter fix. I know that if I have to replace it, I might as well replace the whole system all at once. It would be nice to have an exhaust system with a deeper sound to it anyway.
It is always a gamble. When I bought mine it had been driving like that for at least 2 years. I currently consume about 0.5qt of oil per 3000mi so I think I may have dodged that bullet.

In the end you have to do what you must and there can be good knowledge gained by driving and testing before you sink a ton of time and money.

Your plan seems reasonable to me given your resources.

Come back for help if you need it. Many of us have walked this road (myself recently) and would love to offer assistance where we can.

2004 Wagon S 3.0, 5-speed ATX, Performance White (A2N) 167,000mi
DrFeelGood is offline  
post #10 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-19-2017, 04:27 PM
Registered User
 
jman1200's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Ontario/Canada
Posts: 167
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 22 Post(s)
Thanks: 3
Thanked 21 Times in 19 Posts
Groans: 0
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Garage
iTrader: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrFeelGood View Post
Make sure you check the new valve before you install it. I just purchased one that allowed me to blow air in both directions. This is not ideal. As a result I still have the old one in that I check every oil change.
This is interesting, that is how I always believed the PCV valve should work.
When I bought my M6 back in December I checked and the PCV allowed air to go both ways so I went and bought a new one from Napa. The new one also allowed air to go both ways, I googled a bit about this but didn't find anything to clarify it, even found some sites that said that was how it was supposed to work....

2016-Current: 2006 Mazda 6 GT - V6 - Hatchback w/NAV

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

2008-2015: 2004 Mazda 6 GS - I4

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
jman1200 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Mazda 6 Forums : Mazda 6 Forum / Mazda Atenza Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome